"weird" Syncronisation in MP...(concerning visualisation of AoA)

[Schnarre Aggro]

First: I suck in the Pifty1 and this is not because i got shot down(i allways get shot down in the 51) :megalol:!

 

PLEASE someone explain why this can happen.

 

I encountered several issues with the "visual syncronisation of planes in movement".

like: " a F15 is coming in steep for a gunrun, pulls up WITHOUT showing ANY AoA.!"

i thought that it was maybe due to the netcode changes and didnt investigate it further cause it didnt bother me.

 

But yesterday I saw that it DOES matter a lot when you fly WW2 planes in dogfights(especially turnfighting) when you/I/someone rely heavily on the visual aspect.

Example:

I try to turn only hard enough to deny my opponent the shot.

If I see that "my Six" is pulling enough lead to get a valid shooting solution, i am forced to do sth to deny him the shot(turntighter,changeturn,snaproll, etc) which will cost me valuable energie.

If he cant pull in - i dont need to spent additional energy.

 

TLDR:

for this reason i think

IT IS VERY VERY IMPORTANT THAT ALL PLANE-ATTITUDE IS SHOWN CORRECT !

 

[Bushmanni]

Something wrong with the new extrapolation algorithm. Planes look like they have negative AoA when turning and other funky stuff while maneuvering. Besides looking like having negative AoA the infobar in external view also show negative numbers for AoA when turning tight. Missiles are also desynced with the new algorithm so enemy missiles regularly seem to lose track and then you suddenly blow up anyway.

 

Desync in AoA and missile flight path is a serious problem for doing any kind of BFM. If you use the old extrapolation algorithm planes and missiles seem to fly like they should and the AoA is synced correctly over the network (pilot and spectator see the same AoA).

[Schnarre Aggro]

at least i am not imagine this one ;)

has there been a thread to that topic already ?

What do the Devs say ?

[Winston 60]

I think this whole new multiplayer extrapolation algorithm is proving to be a giant problem for ED to nail down. They just can't seem to get a grip on it yet, although some improvements involving missile hits have been made recently. I'm hoping they still have someone working on this issue.

[DarkRaiderss]

I've noticed the same issue recently. I agree with Schnarre in that I only pull enough to stay out of the other's sights. I've thought I was safe due to the position of his nose and then I was getting hit. I would have pulled more if I saw him getting a firing solution on me.

Edited August 18, 2016 by DarkRaiderss

[Schnarre Aggro]

Can i/we please get a confirmation from the mods/devs that ED acknowledged this "problem" ?

[Solty]

I had the same on many ocasions airplanes shooting with nose down and guys flying sideways.

Here the 109 flies lag pursuit and yet shoots at me and hits.

 

[ame]

[/ame]

 

Here the 190 flies with nose up, wings level but it moves to the sides and down, all the time askew.

 

 

[ame]

[/ame]

 

 

 

It looks as if the game was having problems with updating the position of the model in MP.:joystick:

Edited August 18, 2016 by Solty

[diditopgun]

Same for me !

 

I already talked about it here: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=172319

[Schnarre Aggro]

Same for me !

 

I already talked about it here: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=172319

 

maybe you should link this thread here in your thread ... I read the title and thought "nahhhh i dont care about wingtip vortices - im not reading it ..." ;)

[DefaultFace]

The vortices were not aligned in earlier versions as well even when this bug wasn't a thing yet. Now we have both issues. As Darkraiders said in the WW2 planes the nose attitude of the aircraft is very important in judging defensive maneuvers and in the 109 I use it to calculate lead as well. Both of these can make the WW2 flying somewhat aggravating/more difficult.

 

I appreciate the efforts of trying to fix the warping but I really hope this is fixed soon.

[Nirvi]

;2877293']Can i/we please get a confirmation from the mods/devs that ED acknowledged this "problem" ?

ED is aware of this. The new extrapolation algorithm is still WIP. If you have any tracks showing the issue, please upload them here, thanks!

 

I experienced it too:

Edited September 5, 2016 by Nirvi

[Schnarre Aggro]

Thx Nirvi, that was all i need to know :thumbup:

 

(@Tracks uploading .... all of my tracks are like bigger than 50Mb ... MP tracks ;) )

 

edit: tried it anyway tu upload a track .... gave me some issue "...security token..." blabla ...i guess 104Mb is too much

Edited August 19, 2016 by Schnarre [Aggro]

[Breakshot]

The 51st also have noticed this in our recent flights. The problem is extremely severe, especially on a populated sever! What I don't get is why ED made this new model if the old one had it right! Could have just added some sort of smoothing algorithm to prevent warp spikes...

 

As it stands now BFM is a joke, you can't trust ANYTHING that you see...

 

Sent from mobile Android via Tapatalk

[karambiatos]

The 51st also have noticed this in our recent flights. The problem is extremely severe, especially on a populated sever! What I don't get is why ED made this new model if the old one had it right! Could have just added some sort of smoothing algorithm to prevent warp spikes...

Sadly, you can't mix and match code that's complex like that, and i can only imagine the complexities of the network code in DCS, especially with how fast objects are moving, also it probably made no sense to just update the old code when it was made for a much older era, and with the introduction of AFM aircraft and missiles, the whole thing started falling apart.

 

The network code likely had to be rebuilt, maybe from the ground up, and these are some of the teething issues with it. I have to say though I'll take the current degrees of turn issues over planes going to the moon and back in seconds any day.

[Breakshot]

The net code is simply an evolution of the existing code from LOMAC days...

 

The new algorithm removes an old problem by introducing a much worse one, IMO.

 

I rather have someone going to the moon and back once in a while (it really only happened in extreme cases of server instability), rather than having completely false representation of where everyone is....

 

Sad but, it is what it is. I hope they find a good balance soon!

 

Sent from mobile Android via Tapatalk

[Weltensegler]

I can confirm the exact situation in a F15 vs. F15 turn fight situation.

[Schnarre Aggro]

The purpose of this thread was, to tell ED about some serious problems for the Guys flying MP.

 

We have confirmation from Nirvi (I think mods will not lie nor presume)

so we just have to sit back and wait for ED to fix it .

 

Please dont complain about "theire way of doing things" in this thread .... helps nobody

remember: its done when its done :smartass:

 

instead - keep posting tracks or videos which show the issue.(like Nirvi recommended)

 

kepp it nice and constructive :wub:

[bkthunder]

;2878397']

 

Please dont complain about "theire way of doing things" in this thread .... helps nobody

remember: its done when its done :smartass:

 

 

I don't really agree with "It's done when it's done" in this case. How is it that we are CONSTANTLY flying a beta of a beta of a product? There is an OB branch made exactly for this. I really don't understand why they put something in the "release veriosn" that

 

A- is still in development

B- clearly doesn't work as it should

 

 

The release version should be bug free and with fully developed stuff IMO. If development is slow then be it, who wants can play around with OB, but the moment I want to fly a mission with some friends I could fire up the release version and be sure that I can enjoy my favourite sim without CTD, MP issues etc. which is not the case now.

[SkateZilla]

You can disable the New Network FM and use the old one if you want to while the new fm is being worked on.:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2866297&postcount=25

[bkthunder]

You can disable the New Network FM and use the old one if you want to while the new fm is being worked on.:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2866297&postcount=25

 

Thanks Skate, that's good to know!

 

My comment still stands though ;)

[Breakshot]

I don't really agree with "It's done when it's done" in this case. How is it that we are CONSTANTLY flying a beta of a beta of a product? There is an OB branch made exactly for this. I really don't understand why they put something in the "release veriosn" that

 

A- is still in development

B- clearly doesn't work as it should

 

 

The release version should be bug free and with fully developed stuff IMO. If development is slow then be it, who wants can play around with OB, but the moment I want to fly a mission with some friends I could fire up the release version and be sure that I can enjoy my favourite sim without CTD, MP issues etc. which is not the case now.

I second every word ^

 

It is frustrating and as a result I have seen whole squads disappear from MP scene. Quite frankly I myself have been semi retired (only fly squad events sometimes) from DCS in the last few years for this very reason. It's just not fun tweaking and fixing and testing, ALL the time, instead of flying...

 

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Edited August 24, 2016 by Breakshot

[Bushmanni]

Agree. Developing stuff takes it's time but breaking the game with unfinished or broken features is frustrating as you can't enjoy the game without maybe somehow circumventing the problem or you just don't play.

[Schnarre Aggro]

I guess every dogfighting pilot in MP has experienced the same issue.

Me for myself , try to keep guys away from my six to avoid that frustration .... doesnt work all the time.:joystick:

But IT IS a huge gamebreaker for the WW2 scenario ... thouhg ... come on guys be honest ... we will all Stay/comeback !

There isnt anything(except maybe BMS) wich comes close to DCS.

 

therefore we should try to help them as good as possible, which would be to feed them with tracks.

 

I encourage all of you MP Aces to post tracks on which it is clearly seen what disturbes us ....

 

I still ( after this 7 years) have faith in ED ... it WILL work .... im retired in about 30years ^^, and THEN i have a lot of time to enjoy all the georgous things they will invent until then :smartass:

[DackSter94]

I will put a link for track, in case it helps solving the problem. The thing happens at 15:07:xx time on the server. You can see tracers passing behind :). Video:

 

 

Link to the trk: https://mega.nz/#!B9olVRoL!LfFIHHQasdAB9LRieDvPXZYTMHQJv2sBtLZVY3wd9vw

[Reflected]

Exactly what happened to me on Saturday, only I was in a 109 . It's baffling to see such bugs in such a top notch sim :(