AB operations are correct according to manual

[muehlema]

After the new update, even in air you have to use the finger lifts to enter AB. This is incorrect. Only with Weight on Wheels, the afterburner lockout system is active. In the air not.

Edited June 14, 2018 by muehlema

[QuiGon]

What's your special options setting for the Ab detent?

[muehlema]

What's your special options setting for the Ab detent?

 

It is checked on. I want AB lock system to be active on ground an on carrier like IRL, while there is WOW.

 

Someone said, to untick it, but then AB is active on ground too without fingerlifts, which would be incorrect behaviour either.

[QuiGon]

I see. I haven't checked it myself, but it seems like they implemented it regardless of WOW.

[Buckeye]

It is checked on. I want AB lock system to be active on ground an on carrier like IRL, while there is WOW.

 

Someone said, to untick it, but then AB is active on ground too without fingerlifts, which would be incorrect behaviour either.

 

 

 

In real life with WOW you just push through it anyway.

 

If you have a Warthog throttle, buy the custom 3D printed detent.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[muehlema]

In real life with WOW you just push through it anyway.

 

Correct, but without using the finger lifts, you won't have AB thrust IRL, on ground, as the AB system blocked by the lockout system.

 

Advancing the throttles from OFF to IDLE (during engine start) opens the engine fuel control shutoff valves and activates engine ignition. Finger lifts, on the front of each throttle, must be raised to place the throttles OFF. With weight on the wheels, launch bar retracted and the arresting hook UP or with weight off the wheels, afterburner operation is initiated by advancing the throttles through the MIL detent gates into MAX. On the ground, an afterburner lockout system helps guard against inadvertent afterburner selection. With weight on the wheels and launch bar extended or the arresting hook DOWN, the afterburner lockout extends and the finger lifts must be raised or a force of approximately 32 pounds must be applied before the throttles can be moved to MAX.

[David OC]

Correct, but without using the finger lifts, you won't have AB thrust IRL, on ground, as the AB system blocked by the lockout system.

 

"Or a force of approximately 32 pounds must be applied before the throttles can be moved to MAX"

 

You could ask ED to return the finger lifts for carrier launches as an option too?

Edited June 14, 2018 by David OC

[cofcorpse]

Thank you for feedback! We will think how to modify this option to provide the best experience :joystick:

[Goa]

In real life with WOW you just push through it anyway.

 

If you have a Warthog throttle, buy the custom 3D printed detent.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Where can I buy it?'

[schurem]

Or just file down the detent using a sharpish knife and some sandpaper.

[Rainmaker]

What he is reffering to has zero to do with the detent. It takes a button activation to simulate use of the fingerlifts. The Warthog stick has no mil/AB button activations on it. Two completely seperate things.

[Outlaw24]

Where can I buy it?'

 

I purchased mine for here, the smooth push thru works great for me. https://www.shapeways.com/shops/debolestis?section=TM+Warthog&s=0

Edited June 14, 2018 by Outlaw24

[SkateZilla]

Correct, but without using the finger lifts, you won't have AB thrust IRL, on ground, as the AB system blocked by the lockout system.

 

The Finger Lifts are to Lift the throttles Over the Lockout Gate pin.

 

There are 2 Options to Bypass the Lockout:

 

-Finger Lifts, to lift over the Gate Pin

-30 lbs of Force to push through the gate.

[Fri13]

Thank you for feedback! We will think how to modify this option to provide the best experience :joystick:

 

Could it be possible to get a virtual detent to throttle? Set example a 80-90% range so it doesn't trigger anything until going over it to 90-100%?

 

This possibly is possible to do with custom curves where to set the 80-90% as linear scale and then increase the output of 90+% range?

 

But with the Harrier the virtual nozzle leveler lock is great. To set it and be free to go up/down knowing you don't push nozzles past the given angle.

 

And that is what comes to my mind with the finger lift that no matter how you push the throttle, it doesn't go there, even when in reality the force would do so?

 

Other option that comes to my mind to simulate that force, is to use a throttle speed to overcome it. So if pushing fast enough throttle, it would go past it, but if going slower it then stops to detent?

[Frederf]

What he is reffering to has zero to do with the detent. It takes a button activation to simulate use of the fingerlifts. The Warthog stick has no mil/AB button activations on it. Two completely seperate things.

 

It doesn't but with TARGET programming they can be added.

 

KeyAxis(&Throttle, THR_RIGHT, 0, AXMAP2(LIST(0,70,100), 0, PULSE+'w'));

This will pulse a "W" when entering the region 70-100% for example and does not interfere with the existing axis mapping to control the game throttle axis.

[Eldur]

Thank you for feedback! We will think how to modify this option to provide the best experience :joystick:

 

Just make it stay on no matter what with WOW.

[Buckeye]

Just make it stay on no matter what with WOW.

 

 

 

Why? That’s not at all how it is in the real jet.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Binary]

I could be wrong, but I think you are reading the NATOPS slightly wrong

 

With weight on the wheels, launch bar retracted and the arresting hook UP or with weight off the wheels, afterburner operation is initiated by advancing the throttles through the MIL detent gates into MAX.

 

On an airfield you have weight on the wheels, but the launch bar is retracted and the arresting hook is UP. That is, in this situation, even with WOW, you do not need the finger lifts for engaging AB. What you still have, is the detent - but more on that later.

 

With weight on the wheels and launch bar extended or the arresting hook DOWN, the afterburner lockout extends and the finger lifts must be raised or a force of approximately 32 pounds must be applied before the throttles can be moved to MAX.

 

Again WOW, but now if you have either the launch bar extended or the arresting hook down, the finger lifts are required to get into afterburner.

 

As far as I see, they have added a "virtual" AB detent, which is not the same as the finger-lifts. This virtual detent helps you staying out of the AB, if you don't have a hardware detent in your throttle. The option is enabled by default and can be disabled in the SPECIAL options (uncheck "AFTERBURNER DETENT"). If this option is enabled, you do not have to use the finger-lifts - use the new keybinding "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF" instead.

 

That being said, IMHO, I think the current implementation is correct - just keep the difference between the finger-lifts and the AB detent in mind.

[HiJack]

I could be wrong, but I think you are reading the NATOPS slightly wrong

 

 

 

On an airfield you have weight on the wheels, but the launch bar is retracted and the arresting hook is UP. That is, in this situation, even with WOW, you do not need the finger lifts for engaging AB. What you still have, is the detent - but more on that later.

 

 

 

Again WOW, but now if you have either the launch bar extended or the arresting hook down, the finger lifts are required to get into afterburner.

 

As far as I see, they have added a "virtual" AB detent, which is not the same as the finger-lifts. This virtual detent helps you staying out of the AB, if you don't have a hardware detent in your throttle. The option is enabled by default and can be disabled in the SPECIAL options (uncheck "AFTERBURNER DETENT"). If this option is enabled, you do not have to use the finger-lifts - use the new keybinding "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF" instead.

 

That being said, IMHO, I think the current implementation is correct - just keep the difference between the finger-lifts and the AB detent in mind.

I'm sure it is not correct. You will have to use the finger lift buttons to get in AB when airborne. I'm pretty sure that is not as it was intended.

[muehlema]

I'm sure it is not correct. You will have to use the finger lift buttons to get in AB when airborne. I'm pretty sure that is not as it was intended.

 

Incorrect. I talked to Swiss Airforce Demo Pilot. No finger lift needed to push in the air through the gate into AB. All you got to do is to push a bit firmer.

 

Fingerlift are needed to put the throttles into cutoff from idle position. ;)

 

WOW sensor have influence on a variety of systems on ground

- probes heaters

- nws

- brakes

- l/g handle

 

And lastly AB ops on ground. The use of the finger lifts on ground is not the mechanical bypass, but to tell WOW that AB is OK an bypass the restriction.

 

Cheers

Martin

[Binary]

I'm sure it is not correct. You will have to use the finger lift buttons to get in AB when airborne. I'm pretty sure that is not as it was intended.

 

Just tested it again to make sure.

 

With the Specials Option "AFTERBURNER DETENT" enabled (enabled by default for the current patch). Start on an airfield (so launchbar retracted and hook up). I cannot engage the AB. However, if I press a button mapped to the keybinding option "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF", I am now able to engange the AB. The same applies when airborne. With this keybinding, I can toggle between AB possible / not possible. However, you are right in that it is also possible to engange the AB with the finger-lifts instead of the Detent-keybinding. But I guess the intention with the "AFTERBURNER DETENT" option is to use the "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF" keybinding and not the finger-lifts.

 

With the Specials Option "AFTERBURNER DETENT" disabled, neither finger-lifts nor the detent-keybinding are necessary to engage the AB - both on the ground as well as in-flight.

 

What I would suggest as an improvement is to disable the "AFTERBURNER DETENT" option by default (since there is no default keybinding for "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF").

[Goa]

Or just file down the detent using a sharpish knife and some sandpaper.

 

about manipulationg/cutting the Wartdoh A/B detent could you guys please post a picture of which part should I cut/file down?

[Goa]

I purchased mine for here, the smooth push thru works great for me. https://www.shapeways.com/shops/debolestis?section=TM+Warthog&s=0

 

thanks man, which one should I purchase, there are several detents!!

 

:thumbup:

[Roller25]

If you have a 3d printer print your own out with the file I uploaded here.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=3513780#post3513780

[Davee]

Just tested it again to make sure.

 

With the Specials Option "AFTERBURNER DETENT" enabled (enabled by default for the current patch). Start on an airfield (so launchbar retracted and hook up). I cannot engage the AB. However, if I press a button mapped to the keybinding option "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF", I am now able to engange the AB. The same applies when airborne. With this keybinding, I can toggle between AB possible / not possible. However, you are right in that it is also possible to engange the AB with the finger-lifts instead of the Detent-keybinding. But I guess the intention with the "AFTERBURNER DETENT" option is to use the "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF" keybinding and not the finger-lifts.

 

With the Specials Option "AFTERBURNER DETENT" disabled, neither finger-lifts nor the detent-keybinding are necessary to engage the AB - both on the ground as well as in-flight.

 

What I would suggest as an improvement is to disable the "AFTERBURNER DETENT" option by default (since there is no default keybinding for "Cycle Afterburner Detent - ON/OFF").

 

 

With my WH the afterburner works fine going through its detent. I just unticked the "afterburner detent" box in the setup.