Effect wear off on you?

[Rosebud47]

Is DCS really so much better on a monitor? Never tried to fly on a monitor, as it makes less sense to me than with VR.

Recently I got a Wow-moment at the first flight with a new module - it´s so vivid in dimension and detail... yeah, simply wow.

[TheCabal]

VR is way too inefficient. Maybe in 5 years this will change. Until then, it's an expensive hobby for cracks with money.... buying rigs for thousands of dollars incl. VR to fly with unmaxed graphics... nahhh

[Rosebud47]

I would say, your argument is DCS related only. With "Beat saber" I could max out everything including large FOV. At this point I would start to differentiate, as on some pc hardware, DCS couldn´t be maxed out for monitor flying as well.

[dburne]

Is DCS really so much better on a monitor? Never tried to fly on a monitor, as it makes less sense to me than with VR.

Recently I got a Wow-moment at the first flight with a new module - it´s so vivid in dimension and detail... yeah, simply wow.

 

I have had DCS since the original Black Shark came available in 2008.

Certainly yes the graphics look very nice on a monitor, but it can not compare IMHO to the experience one gets in VR. Words can not even describe it And while not as crisp and sharp in some areas, to me it still looks quite nice. And being "in the world", rather than viewing a small image of it on a monitor, makes all the difference to me.

 

I can only say since first getting into VR in Jan 2017, I have not done any gaming whatsoever on a monitor since. I did try, but it was just no longer the same.

 

This is all very subjective and dependent on the individual though.

[Rosebud47]

Before VR came up in 2017, I didn´t played computer games at all for years, but the new technology and what was possible through that, really pulled me back into pc games.

As I don´t feel satisfaction by jumping around in my living room with VR goggles on my head, cockpit sims became advanced by the new technique. I love the study level of DCS and its level of detail and accuracy, which gives me fun and satisfaction for years in conjunction with VR.

[GunSlingerAUS]

I'm curious, how do you define "proper A/A missions"??

 

Anything with more than 10+ AI aircraft and 10+ SAM units at a time, over varied and detailed landscapes. Playing that on a Reverb, even with my specs, was a total chug-fest for me, stuck at a sluggish 45fps instead of the 90Hz the Reverb is designed to run at.

 

I simply couldn't stand the artefacting caused by today's reprojection tech, but I'm used to playing a lot of VR games at 90Hz, as well as 2D games at 144 or 120Hz (even my 55" runs at 120Hz, so feels super smooth), so I'm probably used to a certain level of smoothness.

 

I agree that VR is utterly amazing when it's running well, but sadly for me that was in the minority of times, and the performance and other problems ruined the sense of immersion. I will be back to try it again when the 3080 Ti comes out though!

[Callsign.Vega]

Ya I don't know how people play on 45 FPS that is motioned smooth.. it feels TERRIBLE. For my VR has to be 90 FPS/Hz or higher.

 

And then on top of it you have to turn DCS graphics down to minecraft level quality... on my 4K OLED I have all graphics besides SSAA maxed and it looks gorgeous.

Edited April 8, 2020 by Callsign.Vega

[Gunnars Driver]

What are you flying IRL?

 

NH90 / Airforce. Have time ob both fixed & rotary wing + a few hours FJ.

[dburne]

Ya I don't know how people play on 45 FPS that is motioned smooth.. it feels TERRIBLE. For my VR has to be 90 FPS/Hz or higher.

 

And then on top of it you have to turn DCS graphics down to minecraft level quality... on my 4K OLED I have all graphics besides SSAA maxed and it looks gorgeous.

 

Depends on the device and how it handles it.

I can only speak to Oculus, and my Rift S does pretty good with ASW running. As does Quest with Link also.

 

None currently can maintain a constant 90 fps in DCS or whatever the device runs to prevent ASW/Motion Smoothing from kicking in.

I run pretty high graphics and have a great experience with my Rift S.

[Baldrick33]

Ya I don't know how people play on 45 FPS that is motioned smooth.. it feels TERRIBLE. For my VR has to be 90 FPS/Hz or higher.

My experience with the Reverb is very positive at 45fps with motion smoothing with DCS. Only when passing another fast moving plane do things start to ghost.

 

I can't run it at 60fps, so it isn't that I am completely insensitive to it and anything below 90fps with motion smoothing off (or similarly dropping below 45 with it on) I find horrible.

 

Settings can be ramped up pretty high when running at 45 so I am happy enough with that. It does seem a bit how we are wired though as some swear that 60fps without motion smoothing is a better option, so I get how some might find motion smoothing not working for them. The problem is the only way is to try it yourself, no amount of reviews or opinions on forums can change that!

[eaglecash867]

My experience with the Reverb is very positive at 45fps with motion smoothing with DCS. Only when passing another fast moving plane do things start to ghost.

 

I can't run it at 60fps, so it isn't that I am completely insensitive to it and anything below 90fps with motion smoothing off (or similarly dropping below 45 with it on) I find horrible.

 

Settings can be ramped up pretty high when running at 45 so I am happy enough with that. It does seem a bit how we are wired though as some swear that 60fps without motion smoothing is a better option, so I get how some might find motion smoothing not working for them. The problem is the only way is to try it yourself, no amount of reviews or opinions on forums can change that!

 

My experience with 45 FPS with motion reprojection on has been the same as yours. I can turn things up to the point where it still shows 45 FPS on the frame counter, but it looks and feels awful. Most of the time, people having problems are trying to run their settings too high. SS or PD have a major impact on that. The higher you go, the worse it gets. I'm running 100% SS right now, with 1.0 DCS PD, and 4X MSAA, and 45 FPS looks and feels just fine. Could I get more clarity by running a higher SS? I could, but the side effects outweigh the benefits for me. It runs great the way I have it set now.

[DutchCoolHand]

Yes, I have felt it. I am thinking it's the lack of hand cockpit interactions. The constant fumbling around throws it off. I guess I have no muscle memory! So I am working building a physical cockpit.

 

Have you checked out the hand controllers for VR called point control? see them here They really add to the immersion, I don't use my mouse unless I need to select a radio message. Read the first message for the details and MilesD is continuing the improvements.

[Bob_Bushman]

Only thing I don't use VR for is the mission editor.

[Callsign.Vega]

My problem is I've been a high speed gamer for most of my life playing at 120+ FPS/Hz. SO it's hard to go back to something like 45 FPS-motion smoothed. It's super noticeable to me how it doesn't feel right. :(

 

Especially when I come out of VR after playing something like Half Life Alyx in which I can run 100% maxed out graphics at 90 FPS and it's so smooth and epic. Your brain gets used to that smoothness.

[Wali763]

Im am successful reconverter from VR to monitor/TrackIR and not regretting it.

 

VR is nice but I never really had that WOW-effect in the first place. There are just too many shortcomings to make it great. At least up to now. At first I tried to accept them (eg the poor resolution) but eventually (one might call this "wear off") I could not. Tested also the Index and Reverb, but both - though being great so some areas - for me are still beging far from really enjoyable.

 

One thing, that also might attribute to my lacking joy with VR is, that I actually dont consider myself as a real pilot like many here do, but more like a gamer. IMO from the distance from monitor to reallife flying VR does only shorten this distance by maybe 10%. Just think of the consequences of not doging an incoming missile in DCS: NONE. In real life that potentially would end your life.

 

Still: also Monitor/TrackIR does have its problems and im pretty sure with the proper hardware Ill "go back" to VR eventually.

Edited April 9, 2020 by Wali763

[CobaltUK]

I actually miss the first time wow experience.

My brain has gotten accustomed now so much so that that initial sense of vertigo, sense of height/falling and more has wore off.

 

Same. Took a couple of days of brief flights to overcome the nausea then a few more days just staying clear of violent manoeuvre's. Then I was over it. Regrettably soon after the desirable sensations, "height/falling" also faded.

 

My HMD has been inoperable for a couple of weeks now and likely to be some more yet but hope to have a taste of those sensations again when fixed. Inevitably that will be a single flight at best. The brain does not so quickly lose what it learnt.

[zaelu]

I play at 20-30FPS. Planes are doubled when scissoring. But, No. Never played on monitor again. Just to setup controls or create missions in ME.

 

The analogy with seeing planes in the movies and books and than meeting them in a museum or airshow up close still stands. The book is nice, can shows details but...

 

I play a certain civil sim on 4k monitor because is alpha and although is awesome is dull without VR

[MegOhm_SD]

Both Rift S and 75” 4k QLED Samsung.

 

I play both. Love VR for the immersion and no it hasn’t worn off.

 

But sometimes I go to the Big Screen 5 ft in front of me and geeeze, the cockpit is life size.

Don’t know how folks can fly on those small monitors anymore. Instantly got rid of mine when I first hooked up my rig to a 55” plasma tv back in 2012.

 

Love the eye candy too much to give that up even if it is 2D.

Edited April 9, 2020 by MegOhm_SD

[Notso]

NH90 / Airforce. Have time ob both fixed & rotary wing + a few hours FJ.

 

Very cool!!

[Notso]

I was an avid flight simmer back in the early days with that other F-16 sim and MSFS. I got bored and gave it up and said I would never stick my toes back into flight simming until VR became mature. VR was just barely even being discussed back then. Then I heard about how great DCS was for several years and finally broke down and bought A-10C in 2011 and hooked it up to a 65" flat screen HDTV thinking it would be wow. I got bored with it within about 45 min and never touched it again.

 

FF to this past summer, I bought an HTC Vive Pro for some FPS games on Steam to see if VR was finally "mature" enough. While setting it up, I read where that old A-10C DCS code on the box would work would work in Steam and I tried it for shiggles. Since then, I've never even opened the FPS games I bought since stepping into a VR DCS cockpit.

 

So no, regardless of the current limitations - it's VR or nothing for me. And I'm still working on trying to justify that Xtal..... :D

Edited April 9, 2020 by Notso

[Eaglewings]

So no, regardless of the current limitations - it's VR or nothing for me. And I'm still working on trying to justify that Xtal..... :D

 

+1

 

For me, it is difficult to discount the place of vr in future. Hard to say there would be any amount of eye candy graphic on 2D monitor that would make me drop vr.

All my future system upgrade plans is heavily geared towards improving my VR experience and I hope the technology continually gets better.

[Notso]

All my future system upgrade plans is heavily geared towards improving my VR experience and I hope the technology continually gets better.

 

Oh, I have no doubt it will almost exponentially continue to get better.

[BMGZ06]

After seeing the release of StarVR I am really looking forward to the future of headsets. StarVR is a better FOV than Pimax without the distortion and they use AMOLED screens with advanced eye tracking. Right now it is technically for enterprise use only but they are looking at selling to consumers. The reviews of it are all positive and they say that you can really only see the screen and the FOV is 210deg horizontal and 130 deg vertical. Far better than anything else out there now. The pricing is said to be between 3000 and 5000 but nothing confirmed.

[Callsign.Vega]

I thought StarVR was dead?

 

https://bit-tech.net/news/tech/peripherals/starbreezes-starvr-cancels-developer-programme/1/

 

Anyone want to sell me an XTal? ;)

[BMGZ06]

I thought StarVR was dead?

 

https://bit-tech.net/news/tech/peripherals/starbreezes-starvr-cancels-developer-programme/1/

 

Anyone want to sell me an XTal? ;)

 

That article is old.

 

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