Jettison bazooka tubes?

[tapi]

Is it possible to jettison empty bazooka tubes in order to have less drag? If yes, how?

[grafspee]

I think this is not possible, due to reload ability of this launchers. Anyway those are just empty tubes, drag cant be terrible. 

[tapi]

OK, thx.

[saburo_cz]

from AAF manual:

 

"The tubes ... and may be jettisoned either before or after the rockets have been fired."

[grafspee]

16 minutes ago, saburo_cz said:

from AAF manual:

 

"The tubes ... and may be jettisoned either before or after the rockets have been fired."

Ok, then how ??

[Jakey-Poo]

I'm glad I googled, as I came here today to ask this exact question.  I don't have the P-51 module yet (waiting for next sale), but are they not jettisonable on that mod?  Perhaps something that will come in an update?

[razo+r]

P-51 does not have bazooka tubes. 

[Jakey-Poo]

12 hours ago, razo+r said:

P-51 does not have bazooka tubes. 

Poop.  I was misremembering.  I thought I'd seen a GS ground attack video where he jettisoned rocket tubes.  Went back and checked and they were wing mounted rockets on hard points.  Dunno what I was remembering.

[joker68]

Tried to jettison them on a mission and couldn't as well. Something still in the Owen for future releases, I guess. P-47 module has a lot of details to be perfected yet, like the instrument lights, for instance. Anyway, the "Thunderbolts" (A-10s included) are among the best modules this sim can offer, IMHO.

[Brigg]

I am pretty certain that they couldnt be jettisoned in RL. Its one of the reasons the real 56th FG used them a couple of times and then refused to use them

 

[Thunderbolt Lightfoot]

This illustration is from AAF 50-5, "Pilot Training Manual For The Thunderbolt P-47" (March 1945). The accompanying description under rockets reads:

 

"When rockets are installed, drop fuel tanks, or bombs may be carried at the same time. The tubes are made of steel or thin plastic material and may be jettisoned either before or after the rockets have been fired. The rockets are about the same size as a 105 mm shell. When you fire six, it's comparable to six rounds delivered by a 105 mm howitzer, a gun that weighs 2 tons. ... You launch the the rocket by pressing the trigger or a button on the stick. The trigger ignites the rocket electrically. A small fire control box in the cockpit enables you to fire the rockets individually or in train, with the projectiles leaving the tubes at intervals of 1/10 of a second. The tubes are bore-sighted with the guns. You can use the gunsight for firing both rockets and machine guns. Carrying rockets has little effect on the flying characteristics of the plane." (I added the bold for emphasis.)

 

This training manual describes the P-47D-25 as the 'new Thunderbolt model' so I think the publication was finalized before the HVAR-carrying P-47D-40 and P-47N-5 became operational. I have not seen rocket operations covered in any other P-47 B/C/D manual including AN 01-65BC-1A "Pilot's Flight Operating Instructions For Army Models P-47D-25, -26, -27, -28, -30 and -35 Airplanes British Model Thunderbolt" (25 January 1945). There is also no indication in AAF 50-5 where the rocket control box was located in the cockpit. This leads me to believe the rocket tubes and fire control box was a depot or field modification, not factory standard. 

 

 

The "competing sim" (the one that has the Bodenplatte expansion and a flyable P-47D-28) mounts this Rocket Fire Control Box under the parking brake handle in its Thunderbolts. This is a very plausible placement in my opinion. In that sim, the long switch on the upper right of the box articulates outward when the rocket tubes are jettisoned. How the competing team came to that conclusion, I do not know. Something worth noting though is that if you look at the cockpit photos of the salvaged P-47D-28 "Dottie May" there is not a rocket control box to be seen. Dottie May flew 90 combat missions before lost in an Austrian lake on May 8, 1945. She was retrieved in 2005 and restored to flying condition. Again, reinforces my belief that the rocket controls were a field modification. This particular control box is not modelled in the DCS Thunderbolt variants.

 

As an aside, consider this 404th Fighter Group P-47D-27RE (42-27221) armed with what is described as three 500 lb. bombs and four 5-inch rockets.

 

Historically the P-47D-30 series introduced the electric bomb release panel located under the parking brake handle that we see in the DCS P-47D-30. The introduction of this box is identified in AN 01-65BC-1A as definitive of the D-30 series. P-47D-30RA 44-32691, according to Bert Kinzey's "P-47 In Detail And Scale," was pulled from operations at what is now Robins AFB and placed directly into storage for the Museum of Aviation in Warner Robins, Ga. It's as close as we can get to a factory default P-47D-30. It has the electric bomb release panel. Rocket controls are not visible to my eye. This may be because this Thunderbolt was operationally used for gunnery practice. For all intents and purposes I think this is how our P-47D-30 (Early) should be modelled. However, without any indication of where a rocket control box would be placed in the cockpit to fire the bazooka tubes, this becomes a mystery to solve. It appears the DCS D-30 "Early" is actually a hybrid that uses earlier bubble-top Thunderbolt elements (ie, the parking brake handle used prior to D-30 and the hardpoint release handles placed to the left of the pilot's seat used through D-27). My theory is DCS intended to add the rocket control box below the parking brake and make this the P-47 capable of carrying the bazooka tubes in the sim.

 

As for the P-47D-40, I believe its HVAR capability from the factory makes it operationally more similar to the P-47N-5 and later models. The P-47N Pilot's Flight Operating Instructions AN 01-65BD-1 describes the P-47N series' rocket operations and shows equipment similar to what is in the DCS P-47D-40. There is nothing indicating in this PFOI or in the P-47N Training Manual that the HVARs can be jettisoned. There is also no indication that the P-47N was designed to be armed with bazooka tubes as an alternative.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Thunderbolt Lightfoot

[Barrett_g]

11 hours ago, Thunderbolt Lightfoot said: 

…

Thank you so much for finding that information!

 

Im assuming all the Razorbacks we see in photos with bazooka tubes were field modded with those rocket control panels, too!

 

Very interesting!

[PETER SHIFTY]

And its planed to be jettisonned in future? 

[FlyBy2507]

51 minutes ago, PETER SHIFTY said:

And its planed to be jettisonned in future? 

 

Same problem on the FW190-A8.
Tube with rocket not fired can be jettisoned.

Empty tube can not.

Reported since March 2020.  

 

[JG13Wulf]

wasn't possible to jettison them on P47

[Barrett_g]

8 hours ago, JG13Wulf said:

wasn't possible to jettison them on P47

Oh thanks for the sentence-fragment response with no references.

 

I also notice  that it directly opposes the actual P-47 Flight manual that was quoted 3 or 4 posts above.

[grafspee]

Only explanation for this is, there is a pin which is hold down while rocket is in tube, but once rocket leaves tube pin goes out locking permanently launching tube to the plane, making impossible to jettison it in flight  

[saburo_cz]

Well, the 4,5" Aircraf Rocket Technical Manual is clear in this case.

If aircaft manual is not enough for some "experts" ...

 

[Cool-Hand]

It's been a little while now, any answer from ED on this?  @NineLine

@BIGNEWY

 

 

Edited October 16, 2024 by Cool-Hand

[Cool-Hand]

 

This would give some reason to actually use the M8 rockets and not lug around the empty tubes the rest of the flight.

Edited October 16, 2024 by Cool-Hand

[MasaMan]

15 hours ago, Cool-Hand said:

 

This would give some reason to actually use the M8 rockets and not lug around the empty tubes the rest of the flight.

 

This!

Can't believe that P-47 in DCS is actually worse than P-51 in ground attack because the only populated server ( 4YA ) only allows these rockets for the P-47 and HVAR for P-51.

I never take these rockets either coz they're just dead weight and drag afterwards, not to mention the skill it takes to hit something with these.

[Cool-Hand]

If that's not enough here is an excerpt from a book detailing a rocket attack using the tubes and dropping them  

[Gunfreak]

My understanding is that HVAR generally were not used a lot in Europe. Not no on the P47 or P51. I've seen a reference to HVAR being used by P47s during Operation Cobra. This was the first use of HVAR I Europe. However they do not seem to use then a lot.

In the book tail end Charlie. He author flies P47s in northern Italy,southern France and Germany in late 44 to end of the war. Flying the latest D models. Yet he never used rockets. Just regular bombs.

[Cool-Hand]

Any word since I messaged you the documents I had?
@NineLine

[NineLine]

On 1/6/2025 at 1:20 PM, Cool-Hand said:

Any word since I messaged you the documents I had?
@NineLine

Do you mean the screenshots above?