fixed Clouds do not cast shadow on water

[Aarnoman]

DCS Version: DCS Open Beta 2.7.7.14727 

Brief description of bug: Clouds currently only cast shadows on terrain, but not onto water.

Expected behaviour: Clouds cast shadows on all surfaces including water.

To reproduce:

1) Mission with clouds set in daytime.

2) Observe lack of shadows on water.

 

This: (in game screenshot)

 

Should look more like this - note the continuation of the terrain cloud shadow into the ocean, as would be expected (quick mockup in GIMP)

Why is this important: Cloud shadows serve an important function from both a graphical and gameplay perspective.

The graphical function is fairly self explenatory - because shadows are cast on both terrain and water in real life, it will naturally look more authentic.

The gameplay function perhaps not as much: shadows help break up the monotonous ocean surface, allowing for more accurate interpretation of altitude/distance. This has been partly improved already through the addition of the improved water shaders in this open beta update. However, with the addition of cloud shadows casting onto the water surface, this will be singifcantly enhanced, further enhancing the naval environment within DCS.

Edited October 23, 2021 by Aarnoman
Example2 added

[Aarnoman]

Addendum example mission on Caucasus, as requested.

See spawned unit and look north - you will see an image as follows. Note the lack of cloud shadow over the water. This is the case for any cloud preset on any map.

Note, don't confuse the water shaders for shadows - they occasionally mimic the look of shadows when directly under a cloud, but as can be seen from a distnace, the clouds do not cast a correct dynamic shadow on water surface.

 

CloudsNoShadowTest.miz

[Aarnoman]

Bump

 

[PLUTON]

I will have to check tomorrow
but this is obvious

[Nealius]

Clouds do cast shadow when looking directly towards the sun, but when not looking towards the sun they do not. This has been the case since before the new water shaders were introduced. 

[REDEYE_CVW-66]

Still a thing.

[Flappie]

Not a thing anymore in latest OB patch. Enjoy, it's beautiful.

Thanks for bringing attention to this thread.

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

this still happens in DCS 2.9

[silverdevil]

22 minutes ago, Ala12Rv-Muscat said:

this still happens in DCS 2.9

i am not seeing a problem with your screenshots. from my perspective, the dark spots on the water are shadows. forgive me if i am missing something.

[Hiob]

1 hour ago, Ala12Rv-Muscat said:

this still happens in DCS 2.9

Your pictures aren't very self-evident, unlike OPs were. Hard to judge from a still, what are hard shadows in a seemingly more overcast environment. Not dismissing your claim, I just think the examples aren't the best to make your case.

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

En 16/3/2024 a las 22:53, Hiob dijo:

Your pictures aren't very self-evident, unlike OPs were. Hard to judge from a still, what are hard shadows in a seemingly more overcast environment. Not dismissing your claim, I just think the examples aren't the best to make your case.

then improve them and put them yourself to see if your examples are better...

En 16/3/2024 a las 21:37, silverdevil dijo:

i am not seeing a problem with your screenshots. from my perspective, the dark spots on the water are shadows. forgive me if i am missing something.

what you are missing is that if you are happy with these pixelated shadows by miles this is not your place, I encourage you to search (on google for example) how are the shadows of the clouds on the sea seen from the air so you realize that this post is about trying to report to ED that these shadows on the sim are not as they should be.

 

as simple as that, there are two kinds of people, those who try to make this sim as realistic as possible trying to help ED by providing evidence and those who only settle for the basics without any criteria, choose which side you want to be on.

Edited March 25, 2024 by Ala12Rv-Muscat

[Hiob]

19 minutes ago, Ala12Rv-Muscat said:

then improve them and put them yourself to see if your examples are better...

It's your case, not mine. Jeeze, I was just giving a bit of feedback on your examples...with good intentions.

I won't lift another finger. Mainly because I don't like the demeanor in your last post. Good luck! 

[Flappie]

@Ala12Rv-Muscat Please post a DCS track showing your issue, along with your options.lua file (from "Saved Games/DCS.../Config"). We'll be able to check whether we get the same result or not.

 

Or try purging your shaders (DCS "fxo" and "metashaders" folders, both located in "Saved Games/DCS.../" - also purge your GPU shader cache).

By the way, when this thread was created, there was no cloud shadow on water. Zero, nada, zip. Your issue is different.

[Lixma 06]

This is a strange one. Here's two pic from the same flight. Clouds on 'Standard', water on 'High'

From one angle the cloud shadows very clearly, and sharply, stop at the coast.

From a different angle (looking towards a low sun) the shadows do seem to be there. But they are only visible when contrasted against the sun's glare.

[Flappie]

Can you please attach a track showing this issue?

[Lixma 06]

OK, I'm on Team 'Cloud Shadows Are There' - but - they are not as visible over the water as over land. A lot depends on the type of cloud and its altitude.

Quick vid and some pics (Water high, clouds standard)

This last pic was from 22k (online) and I couldn't make out any shadows. The clouds, IIRC, were at 12k. Don't know if this is realistic.

 

Test Normandy Clouds Test.miz

 

Edited March 27, 2024 by Lixma 06

[Hiob]

Maybe it is more a problem with how the water is rendered in DCS, then with the clouds?

I mean bodies of water leave a lot to be desired still in DCS (shallow water/surface layer being to transparent e.g.)....

It is not the most vital part of a flight sim, so I get that there is probably more important stuff to be improved. But still....

Edited March 27, 2024 by Hiob

[Lixma 06]

6 hours ago, Hiob said:

Maybe it is more a problem with how the water is rendered in DCS, then with the clouds?

Could be. It might also be the case that with current tech increasing the shadow effect over water to look more realistic will make the shadows over land practically solid black.

Couple more pics of real cloud shadows over water.

Compare from game to real life 

[Flappie]

@Lixma 06 I agree they don't look the same over the sea, but its that a bug? Dirt stops the light, but water does not.

 

Normandy.trk

[Dragon1-1]

They should look more consistent between water and land. Shadows are caused by blocking of sunlight, not any material properties. They come "on top" of things they're cast on, the reduction in light intensity is visibly uniform.

[Lixma 06]

8 hours ago, Flappie said:

@Lixma 06 I agree they don't look the same over the sea, but its that a bug? Dirt stops the light, but water does not.

 

Normandy.trk 176.36 kB · 1 download

I don't think it's a bug, more an unintended feature of the current engine.

Here's a couple of photos over land and sea. Similar clouds* casting similar shadows.

* meteorologists don't @ me

Edited March 29, 2024 by Lixma 06

[=Pedro=]

I was crusing with my Viper on long deep strike mission, most of the Time over water. I noticed no clouds shadows on rhe water. This is how I manage to found this thread. 

I raport, this still exist even in high Settings. 

The top of this thread says that this has already been raported but can we have an official statement on this matter? 

@BIGNEWY?

 

Thanks in advance. 

S!