waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[freehand]

1 minute ago, Hammer1-1 said:

people need to realize that buying things Early Access comes with liabilies, and Razbam modules just qualified that life experience; some people never think itll never happen to them. It did, all they can hope for is that something gets worked out...but should expect the worst moving forward. Its on them if they dont see it that way.

You own any of razbam modules ?

[Hammer1-1]

9 minutes ago, freehand said:

You own any of razbam modules ?

dude, I own the whole damned store. yes that includes the VEAO Hawk T.1A.

Edited June 8, 2024 by Hammer1-1

[Jackjack171]

8 minutes ago, Maduce said:

I wasn't trying to speak for other, but I am noticing that MANY customers are putting on hold any future purchases from ED and yes some of it will be all talk, but still, some of it will not. That is a symptom of losing faith in the future support of modules that ED sells. No, it's not life changing event for me as a customer, but it could be for ED if they lose too many customers. It's a wakeup call. 

 

Respectfully,

 

That's all good. Here's the thing, those that are putting future purchases on hold STILL have other modules that they have paid for. It is highly doubtful, with the emotional responses seen over the SE, that these fellow users will just quit DCS cold turkey. Any customers that are about that life WILL leave, which is not many, but others will stay and newcomers will come as long as the platform is here. I'm afraid this is just a ripple in the pond, not a wakeup call! I too paid for the SE and am disappointed, but life goes on and is not perfect. I got modules for days and 2 brand new ones. 

[freehand]

5 minutes ago, Hammer1-1 said:

dude, I own the whole damned store. yes that includes the VEAO Hawk T.1A.

 

In that case that is very admirable of you taking it on the chin like that but many will not dude.

[Maduce]

Just now, Jackjack171 said:

That's all good. Here's the thing, those that are putting future purchases on hold STILL have other modules that they have paid for. It is highly doubtful, with the emotional responses seen over the SE, that these fellow users will just quit DCS cold turkey. Any customers that are about that life WILL leave, which is not many, but others will stay and newcomers will come as long as the platform is here. I'm afraid this is just a ripple in the pond, not a wakeup call! I too paid for the SE and am disappointed, but life goes on and is not perfect. I got modules for days and 2 brand new ones. 

Man, I hope you are right! I love this community and hate to see it in disarray. I held my nose and crossed my fingers and bought the Kiowa, I purchased the F-4 last fall. I can't say for the time being that I will buy anything else for a while, at least until we have positive updates from ED. That is my choice and I completely understand if others make a different decision. 

[RichCotte]

Well, I’ll chime in and say that I’m extremely disappointed in the whole debacle and as an SE purchaser and South Atlantic as well, I certainly hope that ED will do something to compensate their customers.  What does that mean, I’m not really sure.  Maybe it’s take over the map’s future development, though I doubt they have the capability to do that effectively with the SE module.  So, maybe it’s store credit or a  discount on some other module.

Im not gonna quit playing DCS, but it would be nice to see ED step up and take care of their customers.

[freehand]

6 minutes ago, RichCotte said:

Well, I’ll chime in and say that I’m extremely disappointed in the whole debacle and as an SE purchaser and South Atlantic as well, I certainly hope that ED will do something to compensate their customers.  What does that mean, I’m not really sure.  Maybe it’s take over the map’s future development, though I doubt they have the capability to do that effectively with the SE module.  So, maybe it’s store credit or a  discount on some other module.

Im not gonna quit playing DCS, but it would be nice to see ED step up and take care of their customers.

Nick Grey is a English gentleman he will take care of his customers I assure you.

[Stubbies2003]

5 hours ago, crazysundog said:

However, I have never, nor has anybody ever seen any evidence that the Razbam modules will not be supported in the future, whatever the outcome of this predicament.  You only offer speculation that this is the case.  

 

 

 

 

Perhaps you need to re-read the Razbam statement.  Which officially said that their modules weren't going to be getting any work until the situation was resolved to the mutual benefit of both parties.  Hence they are saying that if they aren't happy with the outcome the modules are done with support.

[ChuckJäger]

this thread is going a bit bananas and missing the point.  At the end of the day the community needs some reassurance from RB and ED that this matter is moving toward a resolution, end of the story.

[Oban]

2 minutes ago, ChuckJäger said:

this thread is going a bit bananas and missing the point.  At the end of the day the community needs some reassurance from RB and ED that this matter is moving toward a resolution, end of the story.

There's been umpteen posts to state that both parties are working towards a resolution, neither party has opted to pull the plug, considering it's all going through lawyers, not sure what you're expecting.

[Major_Mayhem]

1 minute ago, Oban said:

There's been umpteen posts to state that both parties are working towards a resolution, neither party has opted to pull the plug, considering it's all going through lawyers, not sure what you're expecting.

A refund

[Oban]

 

Just now, Major_Mayhem said:

A refund

2 weeks !! 
Big Newy has already said that there's a backlog for the refunds

[=DROOPY=]

3 hours ago, Shibiswag said:

You are still not intitled to a refund because again you purchased a product knowingly it was unfinished.

Entitled~

Dictionary

Definitions from Oxford Languages · Learn more

 

 

 

 

 

en·ti·tled

/inˈtīdld,enˈtīdld/

adjective

adjective: entitled

1. believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment.

   "kids who feel so entitled and think the world will revolve around them"

[Ornithopter]

I should probably start thinking about getting an Avatar, because every other flight sim forum has become very boring compared to this one.

[=DROOPY=]

 

 

2 hours ago, Tom P said:

Why this thread is just a bunch of dudes who think their opinions make a difference. 

O. M. G.   THREAD WINNER!!!! 

 

Edited June 8, 2024 by =DROOPY=

[F900EX]

Every DCS patch that is released something new will be broken in these modules, it could get to the point the module/s (F-15E) is unplayable, if the lawyers start getting involved forget about it, it's toast.   I think players don't realize this, if there where no DCS patches and updates there would not be an issue.

And for this above reason ED/DCS need to stop selling Razbam module's, especially the F-15E until there is an agreement, if there is not, all these modules will end up like the Hawk.   Unless I'm told otherwise this is FACT and your wasting your money.

 

[Pipe]

6 hours ago, crazysundog said:

So get your money back.

Vote with your wallet - That is business.

The problem is you dont get your moeny back, store credit is not a refund period

[Tom P]

57 minutes ago, =DROOPY= said:

O. M. G.   THREAD WINNER!!!! 

It's the same handful of dudes going back and forth for 50+ pages.. 

[Hammer1-1]

2 hours ago, freehand said:

In that case that is very admirable of you taking it on the chin like that but many will not dude.

and we shouldnt have to...but we occasionally do.

[Major_Mayhem]

2 hours ago, Oban said:

 

2 weeks !! 
Big Newy has already said that there's a backlog for the refunds

So after the F4u but before Vulcan and a world map.
I hope I live that long

Edit: and I deleted that post, It was a little to harsh even for me and Its not going to do anything but add to the toxicity of this thread and subject matter and I need to keep my BP down. Wish you all the best on the best on this <S>

Edited June 8, 2024 by Major_Mayhem

[Hammer1-1]

13 hours ago, salling772 said:

My thoughts on razbam.

Razbam did something that Breached their 3rd party contract = stop payment

Razbam response stopping support = another breached of contract

Razban publicly airs a narrative = doubles down

Ed put out a statement and stands the line = this is our platform

Razbam devs continue to post their not talking = Ed has decided to show razbam the door

Ed continues to sale razbam modules under contract with razbam = if they pull it it would be a breach in the contract on ed side. Making legal liability to Razbam they will not do that. 

Razbam 3rd party contracts has an abandoned module clause in it. Yes they sign it to get the f-15e out. = ed waiting for that time to expire to implement the clause. 

Razbam statement saying they are working with ed = Razbam is calling but ED not picking up.

If razbam was true where the other 3rd third-party developers support. = we are not going to jeopardize Revenue stream by your actions. By the way thanks by name dropping and jeopardize a new module release.

Conclusion Razbam has shot it own tail off.

Will they land it.

My opinion using my 30 years In runing my own company

Razban is done as a 3rd party developer on the dcs platform. As more 3rd party developers come in and a number of independent moder have a roadmap on becoming official developers ED can let razbam go.

In the early days of dcs when ED needed 3rd party developers and they put up with Razbam behavior.

2017-2018 ED put their foot down and said no new modules until you fix the bugs. Aka the bug website on razbam webpage.

ED will stay Silent as their lawyers are telling them that. Any additional statements will hurt their position. 

Why keep a 3rd party developer that will be an agitator and not a partner. 

What will we see as the end user?

Unfortunately most if not all of razbam modules will break in some form or other on the coming updates. Until Razbam come back ( I think this will not happen) or we will have to wait until ED takes them in house per the abandoned Module clause. That could take years. The ball is in Razbam Court and I see only two options.

1. Razbam start updates (25% change because ego is involved)

2. Razbam Makes the agreement to Separate from dcs and hands their dcs Module development and upkeep to ED. (The dcs module are ED Property as it was made with dcs development software or sdk)

This hits the nail right on the head. Ive often thought that they think they could get away with some of the actions they took when selling aircraft in FSX...like bugfixes and not blaming it on the platform instead of shoddy code.

[Hammer1-1]

3 minutes ago, Fropa said:

Is ED paying you to be their PIO? If not, they should be…

I cant = anymore

[bumfire]

I don’t post often, but I’m disheartened to hear about problems between both Razbam and Eagle Dynamics, however, Razbam being one of the best module makers for DCS out there, I have faith that they will not abandon their products. I don’t know what the problems are and who is to blame if anyone, but I’m sure things can be worked out amicably.
 

If whatever the problem are and if they can’t be worked out, then shame on both of them.  I don’t know what the actual problem is and don’t care as it’s none of my business, however at the end of the day Razbam needs ED and ED needs Razbam. It’s as simple as that, as people won’t buy modules if they knew they would not get any bug fixes for them.

 

Anyway, thats my tuppence regarding the subject and I have my fingers crossed for a speedy resolution to this matter.

[Hummingbird]

I'd be fine with a refund being miles points to buy another module tbh. I just don't wanna be left with nothing for my money. 

So would I be sad if ED and Razbam don't figure it out? Yes, for sure. But  I wont throw a tantrum about it, esp. since I don't have the exact details about why the break occured. 

[Silver_Dragon]

2 hours ago, Major_Mayhem said:

So after the F4u but before Vulcan and a world map.
I hope I live that long

Someone need remember the "Where are my F/A-18C/F-16C/AH-64/Mi-24P"... has only the same circle, the "drama" nothing has change from 15 years ago.