DCS: F-5E Remastered - First impressions

[Finlayson]

15 hours ago, VZ_342 said:

That'd be my advice as well. I went in with full trust thinking "ooh man, this is gonna be great!" but afterwards...eh, I like the skins I had (and still have them, but no way to use them)

 

Back up your original F-5E-3 files!

IMHO, that's not necessary at all, because...

1. The old F-5E is not going anywhere. It is still supported, you can still fly (and install and uninstall) it as often as you see fit. No need for a farewell flight.

2. ED has to continue to support the old F-5E or force everybody to buy the update (or make it a free update), which they are not doing, at least for now.

3. The new F-5E does *not* overwrite or clobber the installation of the old F-5E. It is installed as a separate module in the folder "F-5E 2024"

4. You can have both installed and switch between them via the plugin enable/disable feature in DCS Module manager (restart required) or the new DCS Launcher (before start).

5. The new F-5E automatically disables the old F-5E during initialization in case both are installed and enabled.

So, obviously ED wants the new F-5E to be a seamless replacement for the old F-5E such that all settings and bindings carry over from the old F-5E, and all missions/campaigns automatically use the new F-5E if it is installed and enabled. They perfectly implemented exactly that. I don't see any problems here.

But the fact that they packed and/or encrypted the textures in that new .edce format is another matter. Would be interesting to know if this is a security feature to protect against somebody extracting the 3D models and textures and using them outside of DCS, or if they want to prevent modding, or if it is simply a new standard way of storing these assets supported by their engine. Anyways, I always loved the fact that one can modify the textures, and it would be a shame if that feature is taken away from DCS in future modules.

[Schmidtfire]

3 minutes ago, Finlayson said:

But the fact that they packed and/or encrypted the textures in that new .edce format is another matter. Would be interesting to know if this is a security feature to protect against somebody extracting the 3D models and textures and using them outside of DCS, or if they want to prevent modding, or if it is simply a new standard way of storing these assets supported by their engine.

I used to do a fair bit of modding, but it's not worth going through the hoops anymore  The worst part is that many mods are fixes to issues
that are left hanging for years on end, improving the products that really need it. I understand ED wants to protect their assets, but it's getting to
a level where it's not worth the hassle. Not to mention the clunky IC system that blocks a lot of good community stuff in multiplayer.

[Bucic]

Just look at that landing gear detail! (video still processing)

 

[twistking]

2 hours ago, NineLine said:

The only 'issue' I know about the radar is the ground clutter noise, and while it may be revisited in the future it was out of the scope for what was being done here.

The Mavericks, even if a dev from 8+ years ago mentioned they would 'like' to do it would have required modelling a different version than we have now, I know some of you are ok with just slapping different weapons on, but I also remember the extra HARMs on the Viper, and even if it made sense, people were still upset by this. 

The intent of this 9.99 update was to improve the overall art and 3D modelling of the module. Being disappointed is fine, but keep I mind we did not promise or suggest it would be more than this. Thanks. 

Yes, i was referring to the ground clutter visuals. Functionality has always been o.k.

It was not my intention to suggest that promises were broken. The Mavericks were more of an example of something that would have pushed the upgrade to something that felt more like a labor of love (or passion in ED's terms) instead of a minimum viable product.

Please consider putting resources into nicer radar visuals for the midterm. Of course a dynamically simulated ground clutter would be the gold standard, but for the short-term you could improve it a lot simply by tweaking the visuals a bit. There's already a user mod that improves the scope just by tweaking the colour values i believe... I'd guess that a talented technical artist could cook something up in an afternoon that would look more convincing than what is in the game now.

[Dragon1-1]

I suspect this is art-only update because they only had the artists working on it full time, and not the coders. So anything that required coding, besides bugs, was left as is. The scope of the update is rather narrow, but from the development POV, it fits with a particular skillset. Remember that the skills required to make a module are quite diverse, and some team members might have a higher workload than others.

[Dovivan]

Guys, can you open the service doors? They can be binded, but it seems  not working."

[Madpie]

Damn that outside looks incredible. It's a shame they didn't spend an equal amount of effort on the inside that we see 99 percent of the time.

[gulredrel]

6 hours ago, Dovivan said:

Guys, can you open the service doors? They can be binded, but it seems  not working."

Nineline stated that it is currently not working in our official build but will work with a later update.

 

 

[Schmidtfire]

1 hour ago, Madpie said:

Damn that outside looks incredible. It's a shame they didn't spend an equal amount of effort on the inside that we see 99 percent of the time.

Sometimes I wonder if the devs even play DCS themselves

Don’t get me wrong, details on the landing gear is awesome. The external model looks very impressive sitting on the ramp or in the air - for videos and screenshots.

But as a regular player flying and fighting in the F-5E,  my eyes are INSIDE the cockpit. And in prominent view is the radar. Again, I don’t think most of us expected a radar rework. But some tweaks to the clutter and indication-files could have been done in photoshop without much time spent.

Anyways, lets hope that ED can find some time to improve. Or to allow indication textures to be properly modded (and IC allowed) by the users themselves.

[frumpy]

On 12/4/2024 at 10:57 PM, hairbear29 said:

It would be helpful to see side by side comparison pics of the cockpit as I'm not seeing any real improvement but it is hard to tell from watching I video on a small screen ATM my credit card is staying in my wallet

Same here. I was tempted to buy it, but fortunately used my brain first. I don't care about the external model. I checked a video of the new ones cockpit and compared with the one installed, I was not impressed at all. It was hard for me to find any differences. The lettering is better at some spots, but I don't zoom in that much when flying. The only thing that bothers me on the old one is the flat, artificial looking ADI, did it improve any on the new version?

Not saying that there has been many, many hours in it, but the cockpit being 5% more clear does not justify $10. In other parts of the world $10 will feed an entire family for days.

[Beirut]

2 hours ago, frumpy said:

Not saying that there has been many, many hours in it, but the cockpit being 5% more clear does not justify $10.

 

5%... 50%... 80%? Hard to say. But it looks nice. And looking nice is a big part of my DCS fun. I'm a sucker for eye candy. I want things to look as cool as possible. The F5 looks good, feels fresh, and I'm enjoying my flights. That's my $10 worth.

 

2 hours ago, frumpy said:

In other parts of the world $10 will feed an entire family for days.

 

Good reason to be thankful for our abundance and good fortune.

 

And a great reason - and season - to remember to donate to your local food bank. 

[Bucic]

2 hours ago, frumpy said:

Same here. I was tempted to buy it, but fortunately used my brain first. I don't care about the external model. I checked a video of the new ones cockpit and compared with the one installed, I was not impressed at all. It was hard for me to find any differences. The lettering is better at some spots, but I don't zoom in that much when flying. The only thing that bothers me on the old one is the flat, artificial looking ADI, did it improve any on the new version?

Not saying that there has been many, many hours in it, but the cockpit being 5% more clear does not justify $10. In other parts of the world $10 will feed an entire family for days.

It's weird that you mention the labels as a positive because they come with serious issues across the entire cockpit. I'm going to report specific cockpit issues separately.

[twistking]

4 hours ago, Schmidtfire said:

[...] But as a regular player flying and fighting in the F-5E,  my eyes are INSIDE the cockpit. And in prominent view is the radar. Again, I don’t think most of us expected a radar rework. But some tweaks to the clutter and indication-files could have been done in photoshop without much time spent. [...]

Exactly. ED, if you can't spare an engineer at the moment, at least throw an artist at the issue.

[Tom P]

Get it now before it's the cost of the viper, hornet, and warthog

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

12 minutes ago, Tom P said:

Get it now before it's the cost of the viper, hornet, and warthog

Yes exactly, as nice as it is to have the new textures, the upgrade is definitely not worth $15. I hope this is not a trend that we can expect in the future as well for the F-86, MiG-15, UH-1, Mi-8, ...

[ThorBrasil]

1 minute ago, ThorBrasil said:

I purchased the F-5E remaster, but was disappointed that these items listed below were not included.
The A10C v2 and Ka50v3 upgrades had more features than the F-5E. I hope that all the skins that were on the old F-5E will be ported to the new one. I still can't believe that it took about 7,000 hours of work to make this F-5E remaster.

The list of items that should have been included in the remaster.
•Digital radio,
•Aerial refueling probe,
•A new radar in the same style as the F-4E,
•Being able to arm the aircraft with four AIM-9,
•External power (provided by ground cart) in the same style as the F-4E,
•External air (provided by ground cart) in the same style as the F-4E,
•Boarding ladder and boarding steps.
•They say that the dimensions of the F-5E cockpit are wrong and were not corrected in the remaster, but I can't prove it.

The F-5E could receive this in the future and the value of the aircraft could be adjusted to $70 or $80. This would be the best case scenario for it to receive all these resources.

And finally, I believe this update should be free. If everything I listed was included, I would have paid more than $10, maybe $15 to $20. I hope the next updates are rethought in their format for the Huey, Mi8, L39, F86 and MiG15. I wish the best for ED and I always support its development by purchasing its modules. Apart from the campaigns, I have practically all the modules. I wish the best to ED and thank you!

 

 

 

 

[Padonis]

W porównaniu do tego, co dostaliśmy za 9,99$ jako rozwinięcie A-10C, jest to w najlepszym razie żałosne jak na F-5. Jeśli to 7000 godzin pracy, to zastanawiam się, ile godzin pracy włożyli w A-10C II lub K-50? Someone here seems to have lost a " , "?
Kupiłem i żałuję, nie polecam...

Edited December 6, 2024 by Padonis

[nairb121]

33 minutes ago, ThorBrasil said:

This radar clip is really valuable, not just in showcasing the correct appearance of the clutter, but also functionality. For example - the elevation bar is clearly indicating a 2-bar scan, while ours remains fixed, even for the 5-, 10-, and 20-mile ranges where it should be operating in 3-degree 2-bar scan.

I am a bit confused by the lock though - prior to acquisition, the return doesn't seem to be within the range gate, rather it's on the horizon bar where the aim symbol then appears when locked? (Could also just be something to do with the FAIL indication)

[coreyhkh]

This update sucks, ok the art is great but they should have included a little more or lower the price to $4.99

[bandit648]

From the newsletter today:

• Three different helmets with 4 separate liveries

What is that supposed to mean? I can't find any different helmet models.

Is there going to be modelviewer update to allow for the new ".edce" files to be read? If not, that sucks. Everything appears to be locked down/encryped with this new F-5E.

 

[VPS_SPIT]

3 hours ago, nairb121 said:

This radar clip is really valuable, not just in showcasing the correct appearance of the clutter, but also functionality. For example - the elevation bar is clearly indicating a 2-bar scan, while ours remains fixed, even for the 5-, 10-, and 20-mile ranges where it should be operating in 3-degree 2-bar scan.

I am a bit confused by the lock though - prior to acquisition, the return doesn't seem to be within the range gate, rather it's on the horizon bar where the aim symbol then appears when locked? (Could also just be something to do with the FAIL indication)

On this clip it looks a little bit different. I don't why there is a difference though...

 

It all comes from this documentary by the way, which you'll surely enjoy if you like the F-5 . You can also download it to watch it in HD.
https://www.historic.admin.ch/dma/media/video/49086492-d9fe-4d57-bac1-4b5a8d017f98

Edited December 6, 2024 by VPS_SPIT

[nairb121]

47 minutes ago, VPS_SPIT said:

On this clip it looks a little bit different. I don't why there is a difference though...

 

It all comes from this documentary by the way, which you'll surely enjoy if you like the F-5 . You can also download it to watch it in HD.
https://www.historic.admin.ch/dma/media/video/49086492-d9fe-4d57-bac1-4b5a8d017f98

That's really cool, thanks!
Looks like the first clip was just a bench test so that would explain it being kinda weird.

[Bucic]

1 hour ago, VPS_SPIT said:

On this clip it looks a little bit different. I don't why there is a difference though...

 

It all comes from this documentary by the way, which you'll surely enjoy if you like the F-5 . You can also download it to watch it in HD.
https://www.historic.admin.ch/dma/media/video/49086492-d9fe-4d57-bac1-4b5a8d017f98

"Tigris Helveticus

The film traces the stations in the career of a space fighter."

[VPS_SPIT]

3 minutes ago, Bucic said:

"Tigris Helveticus

The film traces the stations in the career of a space fighter."

Welcome to Switzerland, where if you don't speak german you only get bad translations... 

[Bucic]

1 minute ago, VPS_SPIT said:

Welcome to Switzerland, where if you don't speak german you only get bad translations... 

Who said it's a bad translation. This translation is mighty