Ground target visibility

[Vecko]

WTH

 

It's really difficult to spot units in Aniso adn all maxed out :O

 

:D Go ahead Bob, open your soul... Your English is better .

[Boberro]

Noo noo..... I won't :D

 

I must give you all who uses full aniso my condolences when you have to search enemy units heheheheh xD

[HiJack]

Ahaaaa, i see ,oufff(*wipes sweat from the forehead)... For second i thought that ,maybe, problem is with new realistic settings of lockon...;)

Sure it is! It's not possible to spot these targets. It is built that way so we die :P

 

Anyone that sets out and find these kind of hidden tagets with Su-25/Su-25T is cheating.

Edited May 30, 2010 by HiJack

[topol-m]

That`s why I stopped piloting these flying coffins (Su-25, A-10A). We need more powerful targeting systems in order to find targets at safe distance. Now A-10C will be a different thing ;)

[herig2]

I try to keep one IR Mav to check the target area. I'll used that one just before I RTB.

[159th_Viper]

System settings:

 

Default install + Patch 1.2.1.

Mods - Squad Skin and 3GO Flanker/A-10/F-15 new models.

 

 

12 x AA (4x Edge Detect)

16 x AF

 

Units: Ural 375/BMP-2

 

 

6 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

5 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

3 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

1.5 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

Danger Close:

 

 

 

 

 

As said - Don't go Blaming LockOn 2.0 :)

[MIGHAIL]

i got an idea, how about aim-9 uncage mode for search ground targets? maybe in patch its funy stuff must be will:)

[Prophet]

Having trained as a heavy anti-armor infantryman for 6 years, I can tell you that trying to spot armor from a distance in real life is far harder than even FC2. And I was one of the best in the unit.

 

Why do you think the military uses vehicle identification panels, and even then there are friendly kills?

 

FC1 was a turkey shoot. You could just make multiple passes until everything was dead. In real life you are going to make a single pass, and then you are going to wait for recon data from another flight or the ground to determine the damage you did.

 

I applaud the devs for making it harder. Now if there was better ground vegetation and the ground AI took evasive maneuvers.

 

IMO if you want it easy, use labels, arcade mode, or get Ace Combat.

Edited May 31, 2010 by =Prophet=

[Nerdwing]

I could SWEAR I've seen armored units that I've strafed in my A10 start zig-zagging back and forth in an attempt to evade fire. I dont mean to avoid wrecks either, they just started swerving about to avoid aerial gunfire.

 

EDIT: I'd also like to note that overall I've not had trouble locating vehicles on the ground at a reasonable distance. Alot of the time I'd see civilian traffic at a distance, but you can observe how armored vehicles move in a little distanced convoy and are much easier to pick out.

Edited May 31, 2010 by Nerdwing

[bumfire]

System settings:

 

Default install + Patch 1.2.1.

Mods - Squad Skin and 3GO Flanker/A-10/F-15 new models.

 

 

12 x AA (4x Edge Detect)

16 x AF

 

Units: Ural 375/BMP-2

 

 

6 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

5 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

3 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

1.5 Nautical Miles:

 

 

 

 

Danger Close:

 

 

 

 

 

As said - Don't go Blaming LockOn 2.0 :)

 

You say dont go blaming Lockon ?

 

In those pics you are flying fully zoomed in = hardly realisitc now is it ?

 

How many pilots in real life do you know that can zoom their eyes in ?

 

The scale is waaay off, ok armour has camo in real life and in game to make them harder to spot, but they are still far too small, I dont care what anyone says, because you can see them doesnt mean to say that the game isnt to blame.

 

I have a 1440x900 monitor and larger ones also and with 16xAF and 8xAA I find it hugely difficult to find ground targets, depending on what they are and their location on the map.

 

These settings maybe ok for BS since we are moving slower and closer to the ground, but in LOFC2 they simply need adjusting to something a little more realistic, after all everyone here craves realism and I can tell you that the settings in lockon are not realistic when it comes to view distance for ground targets. I fly every 2 weeks IRL and can see things better in real life without needing to zoom in than I can fully zoomed in with FC2.

 

But, its just my opinion in the end, nothing more, for me I wish they were slightly adjusted to make them ever so slightly more visible, nothign too drastic, just something that would make them stand out when you get within a certain distance.

Edited May 31, 2010 by bumfire

[MoGas]

I will answer you with question...

Do you need telescop in your eyes to(maybe) spot target from 1-2km on the open field even if you know their microlocation? Just imagine real situation like this on picture...Tell me pls, whether the real pilot had any problems to see targets in this kind of situation?

 

P.S. And,can you see something? It is there, right in front of your nose?:) Or maybe you suggest to turn off AA and set textures on low maybe?

 

 

Maybe you should start to read some books, like A-10 over Kosovo or A-10 over the Gulf, then you would understand maybe. And yes they used also binoculars to spot targets in RL, but I guess too many A2G guys are still stuck in there FC1.12 tactic for ground targets hehe.

 

:smilewink:

[Kuky]

I think visual distance is alright, but looking through Tv/IR od it's not... if I know exact position where units should be and I zoom in on Shkval and I still can't see it because the 3d models starts fading in so close that is not correct I think.

[Lightning]

I try to keep one IR Mav to check the target area. I'll used that one just before I RTB.

 

 

Thats my tactics too ! And its a way that definatly works !

You can spot any target with that little monitor.

 

The bad thing :

You can only take maximum 4 Infrared AGM-65 D´s in your payload.

 

That is weird, because the AGM-65 K is heavier in real life and you can take 6 of them on a flight.

Can anyone tell me why it is not possible to take 6 IR Mavericks or is it possible in real life and ED just did not implement this ?

Any real life A-10 Pilots around here to answer that ?

[159th_Viper]

You say dont go blaming Lockon ?

 

In those pics you are flying fully zoomed in = hardly realisitc now is it ?

 

 

My Bad.......I knew I should have posted this at time of my previous post :music_whistling:

 

 

It was a test to illustrate a principle, a test conducted under optimal conditions

 

 

Making sense now? Not yet? Let me explain further..........

 

 

The post was in response to an earlier post stating that Ground Units are practically invisible from sub-2km (also zoomed in btw). What my post then illustrated was that said units in question (replicated as per the label description) are indeed visible from as far as 6nm and continue to stay visible until Danger Close, indicative of a systems error and not LockOn 2.0.

 

Who said anything about 'Realistic' flying at Zoom? That's a debate for another topic - needless to say I'm with Mogas on that one ;)

 

 

 

 

But, its just my opinion in the end, nothing more, for me I wish they were slightly adjusted to make them ever so slightly more visible, nothign too drastic, just something that would make them stand out when you get within a certain distance.

 

 

Why - so we can return to the 'Fish-in-a Barrel' mentality as before? No thanks :)

 

As stated - the Units are there and they're relatively easy to spot all the time if you know where to look....Just takes practice to get to 'know' is all.

[Boberro]

I wonder... how Su-25 had so quite high effectivity in Cold War missions, Afghanistan or Chechnya? Supposedly Russian pilots could have seen targets (yes without anything, cause vanilla Frog is really poor and I doubt if they had uber good binoculars and occasion to use it even when they hadn't autopilot in their Su). So either they spotted units dangerously closely or they were able to see it from futher distance. Anyway I feel full respect for them for flying in this coffin without anything.:D

[aaron886]

I wonder... how Su-25 had so quite high effectivity in Cold War missions, Afghanistan or Chechnya? Supposedly Russian pilots could have seen targets (yes without anything, cause vanilla Frog is really poor and I doubt if they had uber good binoculars and occasion to use it even when they hadn't autopilot in their Su). So either they spotted units dangerously closely or they were able to see it from futher distance. Anyway I feel full respect for them for flying in this coffin without anything.:D

 

Or really good FAC. :thumbup:

[HiJack]

Question: How many of you would even play this game if it was easy? :suspect:

 

It’s OK as it is, you just need to memorize the mission and target spots before flight. I guess they have hours and hours of mission planning irl as well. So I think it’s good as it is, just fix the A-10A slew and I’m happy for now :angel:

 

(HJ)

[winz]

The scale is waaay off, ok armour has camo in real life and in game to make them harder to spot, but they are still far too small

They aren't to small, they are in scale with the rest of the world. You cannot expect realistic projection on something so limited as a LCD display.

 

What do you want ED to do? Increase unit sizes so they do not mach their rl counterparts in diameter? Is it harder to spot than irl? I guess it is, limited LCD capabilities, you beeing a silent lamb and not able to really comunicate with FAC, weak intelligence info most of the time.

 

But on the other hand, you're siting in a comfortable chair, with no real risk to your life, no Gs, nothing, you got the perfect working enviroment.

 

Find it too hard? Tune and use labels, you are not forced to use the red/blue all giving info labels. I've tuned my labels to only display a '.' symbol in dark green/grey color (sometimes I spot the targets model sooner than the label), got them off most of the time, and only turne them on when I'm really frustrated :)

[Jg2001_Rasputin]

Vecko are these screenshots from the 51st Mission from yesterday? You have to admitt, that weather was quite bad. I flew the mission later again, as the sun rose and it became much easier to spot targets.

 

Yes I find it hard to spot targets, but it´s totally fine. A position can now be attacked by a player and not all vehicles will be destroyed so easily. It´s harder espacially if you don´t have a decent briefing or just rough idea where the enemy is located, but it´s much easier to spot vehicles on the move, on a road or shooting vehicles, which meets my expectations of realism.

[Insanatrix]

I just did a test as I have found that sometimes the ground targets are hard to spot. I put a row of targets from a humvee up to a M1 in an open field. I'm running the game at 1920x1080 8xAA edge detect(24x AA?) and 16xAF

 

This is from about 15km to the target fully zoomed in, Knowing beforehand roughly where the targets were.

 

 

 

This is from 8km somewhat zoomed in.

 

And lastly this is from 3km somewhat zoomed in.

 

 

In all 3 pictures you can see the targets visually, even from 15km out. One thing I happened to notice is that the LOD's tend to switch way to close. once you get into the 5-8km range I think the models should become more detailed, not so they look "prettier" but so they aren't a 4 sided square box that is harder to make out from the terrain than say something that looks more like a humvee or a abrams. As it is though it's not impossible to find targets even out to 15km. It's very very hard to, which to me is realistic. The only thing I would suggest is having the higher poly LOD's switch at a little further range to make spotting a bit easier.

[Vecko]

So, conclusion of this topic is to use 120% of zoom and enjoy in life...

You know Viper, i could use max zoom on my screanshots and targets would be visible but I did not want to do that.I never use 100% of zooming,my zoom view axile is on max 80%.

 

If you find realistic that almost nobody from this forum can't count remaining live units in situation from picture ,with used amount of zoom(about 70-80%) ,i realy don't know what to say anymore...But i am sure in one thing,sooner or later most of A-10 and Su-25 lockon pilots(not you Mogas, there is not much to see on 45000 feet) will remember this thread and they will ask them self, what is realism .

 

[159th_Viper]

So, conclusion of this topic is to use 120% of zoom and enjoy in life...

You know Viper, i could use max zoom on my screanshots and targets would be visible but I did not want to do that.I never use 100% of zooming,my zoom view axile is on max 80%.

 

 

Default Cockpit view - No Zoom - 2.1nm out at an altitude of approx 1500m AGL:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why are my Units not invisible and relatively easy to spot?

 

;)

[topol-m]

If you know they are exactly there you`ll spot them, but if you don`t have their exact coordinates good luck finding them :)

[159th_Viper]

If you know they are exactly there you`ll spot them, but if you don`t have their exact coordinates good luck finding them :)

 

Aye - Correct and as it shoud be. Maybe even a bit too easy still without camo etc etc.

 

Point is - they never were and never will be 'Invisible' from sub-2km :)

[winz]

So, conclusion of this topic is to use 120% of zoom and enjoy in life...

I'm still unable to find any solution. What do you propose? Make them twice/triple the size (yummy a t72 size of a house), or paint them all pink so they don't melt with the BG so much?