reported Maverick VIS mode and targeting pod

[twistking]

I remember that it used to be possible to designate with HUD or HMCS, then use the TGP to finetune with the Mavs slaving to the TGP.

Now, when in VIS mode, Maverick will only slave to the HUD, HMCS designation while TGP can look around freely without affecting the MAVs.

Is this a bug or has anything changed? How can i finetune the MAV designation with the TGP? If i would want to quickfire the Mavs from a dirty HUD designation i could use Bore mode. VIS with TGP was very effective and i'd assume that it was also realistic.

Help!

[twistking]

@NineLine@BIGNEWY The three likes on my post, make me think that i've found another bug. Can you move this to the bug section and ideally report it. I know: No track provided, but the behaviour should be immediately obvious to everyone. The only open question is, if this is intended behaviour, whcih i highly doubt.

[Moonshine]

not sure how the sensor logic should be.

when maverick in VIS mode, HUD is SOI -> you can slew the TD box with the cursor slew, maverick will follow the TD box. pressing TMS UP will then ground stabilize the MAV at the TD box location, you can then slew the maverick around and refine its position (indicated by the circle you can slew around). you can either do that on the WPN page itself or directly in the HUD. pressing TMS UP again will attempt a lock.

with the TGP, you can selw the TD box, however, maverick does not follow the TD box location. pressing TMS UP (entering point track) does not ground stabilize the MAV as they arent coupled like they would be in PB mode.

when using the MAV page as SOI directly, not the hud or anything else, slewing around moves the TD box (visible in the HUD), however, pressing TMS UP does try to get a lock on something, not ground stabilizing the MAV. not sure if that is intended behavior or if the ground stabilizing part is skipped/missing.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Moonshine

[twistking]

6 minutes ago, Moonshine said:

not sure how the sensor logic should be.

when maverick in VIS mode, HUD is SOI -> you can slew the TD box with the cursor slew, maverick will follow the TD box. pressing TMS UP will then ground stabilize the MAV at the TD box location, you can then slew the maverick around and refine its position (indicated by the circle you can slew around). you can either do that on the WPN page itself or directly in the HUD.

with the TGP, you can selw the TD box, however, maverick does not follow the TD box location. pressing TMS UP (entering point track) does not ground stabilize the MAV as they arent coupled like they would be in PB mode.

when using the MAV page as SOI directly, not the hud or anything else, slewing around moves the TD box (visible in the HUD), however, pressing TMS UP does try to get a lock on something, not ground stabilizing the MAV. not sure if that is intended behavior or if the ground stabilizing part is skipped/missing.

 

i'd assume that the logic should be, as it was some time ago, where MAV would slave to TGP - if TGP was slewed after initial TD box designation via HUD/HCMS. I assume this, firstly because this would have greater utility without any disadvantage i can think off and secondly because DTOS for Bombs works in the same way: Initially designate with HUD, optionally finetune with TGP...

[Moonshine]

Dont think so, as you can use the maverick image feed to refine the seeker. Only in Pre mode will the mav ever follow the tgp

 

Edit: i stand corrected

Edited May 26, 2023 by Moonshine

[twistking]

20 minutes ago, Moonshine said:

Dont think so, as you can use the maverick image feed to refine the seeker. Only in Pre mode will the mav ever follow the tgp

Mhm... i politely disagree: BORE mode already allows you to target with HUD and refine on the Mav seeker feed. VIS mode for JDAM and DTOS for other bombs definitely have TGP for refinement in mind. The F-16's quirky "feature" to not allow multiple sensor points only makes sense, if you have modes that let you point the TGP via HMCS. In the end it boils down to this: How do you point the TGP via HCMS? -> You select the appropriate weapon mode that lets you do this: DTOS or VIS.
Maverick and TGP are highly integrated, i cannot believe that the Mav implementation would not allow "HMCS to TGP to Mav" flow...

[_SteelFalcon_]

1 minute ago, twistking said:

Mhm... i politely disagree: BORE mode already allows you to target with HUD and refine on the Mav seeker feed. VIS mode for JDAM and DTOS for other bombs definitely have TGP for refinement in mind. The F-16's quirky "feature" to not allow multiple sensor points only makes sense, if you have modes that let you point the TGP via HMCS. In the end it boils down to this: How do you point the TGP via HCMS? -> You select the appropriate weapon mode that lets you do this: DTOS or VIS.
Maverick and TGP are highly integrated, i cannot believe that the Mav implementation would not allow "HMCS to TGP to Mav" flow...

This. A SPI is a SPI.

[Hobel]

vor 48 Minuten schrieb twistking:

Mhm... i politely disagree: BORE mode already allows you to target with HUD and refine on the Mav seeker feed. VIS mode for JDAM and DTOS for other bombs definitely have TGP for refinement in mind. The F-16's quirky "feature" to not allow multiple sensor points only makes sense, if you have modes that let you point the TGP via HMCS. In the end it boils down to this: How do you point the TGP via HCMS? -> You select the appropriate weapon mode that lets you do this: DTOS or VIS.
Maverick and TGP are highly integrated, i cannot believe that the Mav implementation would not allow "HMCS to TGP to Mav" flow...

yes, MAV should also follow the TGP in VIS mode because the TGP provides a SPI.

[SickSidewinder9]

I also noticed that when trying to boresight Mavericks on the ground (for which you really have to have arm and ground jettison on and then it doesn't work very well anyway), pressing SP on the TGP doesn't center the TGP ahead and down.  IDK where it goes, but it's not where it should.  And the proper TGP animations are non existent for all animations.  Putting the TGP into LST mode used to make it do such a cute little wiggle in its little face.  Still does on the Hornet.

And god help you trying to use Mavericks with GMT radar.  Especially without the pod.

[rob10]

4 hours ago, SickSidewinder9 said:

  And the proper TGP animations are non existent for all animations.  Putting the TGP into LST mode used to make it do such a cute little wiggle in its little face.  Still does on the Hornet

That's been reported (and acknowledged) multiple times already.

[SickSidewinder9]

19 hours ago, rob10 said:

That's been reported (and acknowledged) multiple times already.

What's the hold up, how could animations that used to work fine be so glitched after 0 apparent changes to the external model?

[Moonshine]

1 minute ago, SickSidewinder9 said:

What's the hold up, how could animations that used to work fine be so glitched after 0 apparent changes to the external model?

in all honesty, a not working animation for a pod does seem rather minor compared to the amounts of serious bugs in the vipers systems...

[SickSidewinder9]

1 minute ago, Moonshine said:

in all honesty, a not working animation for a pod does seem rather minor compared to the amounts of serious bugs in the vipers systems...

ED can really learn from the Arma team at BI.  Which if you know how glitchy and clunky Arma games can be, is really saying a lot.  But they've had the details of things like modularity of different facets and THE NIGHT SKY AND NIGHT VISION squared away for over 20 years.

Like, ED has been tweaking the RWR so the T Pod stopped working?  Did a cat walk over someone's keyboard?

[Furiz]

10 hours ago, SickSidewinder9 said:

Like, ED has been tweaking the RWR so the T Pod stopped working?  Did a cat walk over someone's keyboard?

Seems like you read half of the news and half of it somehow ran away from you, maybe the cat dragged it away. While working on RWR at the same time they are working on LANTIRN, which is the TGP on our F-16 atm, may be the cause our TGP has gone mad all of the sudden.

 

 

[twistking]

@NineLine@BIGNEWY If this is not yet reported internally, can you move it to the bug section. seems to be confirmed, that it is indeed one. thanks.

[SickSidewinder9]

On 5/31/2023 at 10:34 PM, Furiz said:

Seems like you read half of the news and half of it somehow ran away from you, maybe the cat dragged it away. While working on RWR at the same time they are working on LANTIRN, which is the TGP on our F-16 atm, may be the cause our TGP has gone mad all of the sudden.

 

 

They have been working on TGP models other than the current one, no?

The current pod model is neither the LANTIRN nor the Sniper, right?

[Tholozor]

2 hours ago, SickSidewinder9 said:

The current pod model is neither the LANTIRN nor the Sniper, right?

The exterior model is of a LITENING, but the interface is actually LANTIRN.

[SickSidewinder9]

16 hours ago, Tholozor said:

The exterior model is of a LITENING, but the interface is actually LANTIRN.

In other words, they've made no changes to the external model so the animations shouldn't be nerfed, yeah?

[silverdevil]

On 6/3/2023 at 11:33 AM, SickSidewinder9 said:

In other words, they've made no changes to the external model so the animations shouldn't be nerfed, yeah?

IRL this would be a problem. though with DCS i doubt it. the external model does not move ATM either.

[SickSidewinder9]

On 6/4/2023 at 10:00 AM, silverdevil said:

IRL this would be a problem. though with DCS i doubt it. the external model does not move ATM either.

That's what I mean.  It used to work fine.

[silverdevil]

11 hours ago, SickSidewinder9 said:

That's what I mean.  It used to work fine.

agreed. but unfortunately this seems to happen with DCS. it will eventually get sorted. the issues with TGP on viper (and other AC) has been an issue for a long time.

[Willie Nelson]

Could someone clarify please?

I have been trying to use the HMCS to get my TGP on to a point track for the purposes of AUTO Hand off to an AGM 65D correctly boresighted but this does not appear to be working even though it should.....? 

Is that the  current state of play?

[twistking]

15 hours ago, Willie Nelson said:

Could someone clarify please?

I have been trying to use the HMCS to get my TGP on to a point track for the purposes of AUTO Hand off to an AGM 65D correctly boresighted but this does not appear to be working even though it should.....? 

Is that the  current state of play?

it should work, but i can't test right now. does it work for you in PRE mode without using the HMCS?