2017, Forum Moderation

[BIGNEWY]

It sounds like the practice of quiet removal of uncomfortable (but otherwise perfectly legit) posts is a thing of the past now. Excellent :)

 

nine times out of ten it is not the content of the posts, more the delivery ;)

[msalama]

I've had my share of warnings and actually have one now, still think this is a well moderated site; and, actually, quite _liberal_ a place for a company board too. So well done guys & keep up the spiffin' work :thumbup:

[Abburo]

This is one of the cleanest forum I ever saw. For this I have to thank first to moderators team and secondly to people posting here. Everybody doing a great job!

[Ells228]

Great words Sith :)

[agrasyuk]

nine times out of ten it is not the content of the posts, more the delivery ;)

 

Those things will happen of course. If there is a particular rule being violated by content or delivery then by all means. In such scenario however the offending post probably should get marked as deleted, perhaps sighting the infraction if you feel generous. If healthy community is the goal posts and posters cannot just disappear as if they weren't even there NKVD style.

 

But It looks like you guys are quite satisfied with how things are going. Don't worry, you will not see me spoiling this prestine cleanness to much with uncomfortable questions. Not because I'm afraid to speak, but rather because I find that I no longer care as much. I guess thats one way to achieve the goal, oh well.

[NineLine]

Those things will happen of course. If there is a particular rule being violated by content or delivery then by all means. In such scenario however the offending post probably should get marked as deleted, perhaps sighting the infraction if you feel generous. If healthy community is the goal posts and posters cannot just disappear as if they weren't even there NKVD style.

 

But It looks like you guys are quite satisfied with how things are going. Don't worry, you will not see me spoiling this prestine cleanness to much with uncomfortable questions. Not because I'm afraid to speak, but rather because I find that I no longer care as much. I guess thats one way to achieve the goal, oh well.

 

Generally the post should receive a 0% warning (if no actual warning is needed) this would show up in your warning log, a 0% warning is just information on why the post was removed, now on a giant thread where a ton of OT posts are removed, it can be difficult to go through and do that for every one, but generally a moderator will post in that thread saying they cleaned it up. That said, you can always PM a moderator and ask about these issues.

[theOden]

This is one of the cleanest forum I ever saw.

Maybe there's a reason for this?

[NineLine]

Maybe there's a reason for this?

 

Yes, see OP... short version, a great community.

[howie87]

To be honest, I'm on a 70% warning that is set to never expire for two posts I made back in 2015...

 

I can't remember what either of them said but one of the posts is deleted and the other was in a thread that was deleted entirely!

 

I was banned for a year and then virtually stopped posting after that.

[NineLine]

To be honest, I'm on a 70% warning that is set to never expire for two posts I made back in 2015...

 

I can't remember what either of them said but one of the posts is deleted and the other was in a thread that was deleted entirely!

 

I was banned for a year and then virtually stopped posting after that.

 

You can ask for your warning levels to be reviewed at any time, permanent warnings can be removed if a long time has passed without any issues. You just need to PM a moderator. Any of them can review it for you.

[howie87]

Ok... Thanks... Wow, I was expecting a ban for that! Haha, maybe things have changed round here after all!

[NineLine]

Ok... Thanks... Wow, I was expecting a ban for that! Haha, maybe things have changed round here after all!

 

You asked a simple question, I didn't read any malice in it, as I said, we aren't as scary as some might think :)

 

We only have ever asked to be respectful and polite. The internet doesnt need to be the wild wild west :)

[WinterH]

When people are passionate, and the subject is complex, and the community is sizable, and also there is a corporate image to uphold, things tend to heat up pretty hot, pretty often. Therefore, I really can say I don't envy the job of moderators here. People are always opinionated, and opinions always clash, and as they can't all be right and at odds at the same time, most of the opinions can often be borderline bullshit. And yet, even so people are perfectly entitled to have them, and unless they lack even the basic etiquette about it, entitled to voice them too.

 

So, all in all, I can see the work for mods here is not an easy one at all.

 

Funnily, while I have lurked on ED forums on and off for, perhaps a decade, what finally drive me to create an account, was to address some posts on forum which were negativity without any real reason behind them. I believe that I have articulated my responses in a decent way, so that often, surprisingly, they didn't lead to any flamewars :). So there definitely is merit in saying "it is not the message, but the way it is conveyed".

 

However, I believe that the reason why this is one of the "cleanest" forums is, sometimes at the slightest hint of dissidence, the "forumstaatspolizei" seem to just clean the purported offense, and may be the offender too.

My impression of the mod team was smart and reasonable folks. But may be "fighting the monsters" may breed monsters in oneself. The more often I've seen the moderation team on "damage control mode", the less impartial and more like zealots they began to appear to my eyes.

Especially thinking that forum wars are often fueled by not one but two sides. Yes, the moderation is difficult due to many reasons I've touched above, and yes there can be opinions that are easily tinfoil hat level material. However, like I've said I believe forum toxicity may not necessarily always originate from dissidents. There are those among the community, than don the armour of proverbial white-knights, and form the cavalry corps to trample even the justified criticism, or run through the offenders to their favorite module/brand/dev with a lance, where in reality there is no offense. While indeed it should be the delivery that matters, such individuals that often deliver instigation rather than a message never seem to get so much as a nudge from the moderation, which cast a shadow on their impartiality in my opinion.

 

As such, forum slowly gets "cleaner", but more and more like an echo chamber, and as such has been losing it's charm for me. Yes, meaningless nagging and bickering has been reduced considerably, which is pretty great! But now it seems to me like there is less conversation, and more preaching to the choir.

 

I may well be wrong, I may be reading things in a tinted light that paint it in darker shades than it is. But, with how much I can see, this is how my impression is shaped even as someone who didn't personally had an issue with moderation. (I do have one case I reaaally, reaaally wonder about that isn't directly about me, where a thread that seem perfectly benign has vanished into thin air, but that's not the point of my post here anyway).

 

Well... for the sake of fairness however, I have to say that I never got a warning or ban or such myself. And I've even openly posted about a couple years ago, what amounts to that I'd personally be boycotting the products on a very heated and therefore (perhaps understandably) heavily moderated thread. But I did it in what I consider a decent manner. Neither the post nor myself have vanished into thin air so far :) so sometimes even fairly audacious responses, when not worded offensively, seem to get tolerated here.

 

Anyway, I guess I am bordering on discussing moderation here... lets just say wanted to post "just to balance out the overwhelming positivity in thread for a hopefuly healthy discussion". Here's to a happy and hopefuly great 2017 to the moderation, community, and DCS itself :).

Edited January 9, 2017 by WinterH

[The Black Swan]

Good post, but your're still scary Sithspawn :D

 

I don't do it perfect myself, but if everyone treated others the way they would want to be treated, it would solve most problems.

Otherwise yes, a very good community compared to many.

[David OC]

In the back of my mind I always imagined that SiTh was a highly advanced cybernetic Russian coded forum AI that would eventually end up in the sim after a long beta.

 

I could be wrong now; otherwise ED has done a great job and SiTh has passed the Turing test with ease. :)

[NineLine]

In the back of my mind I always imagined that SiTh was a highly advanced cybernetic Russian coded forum AI that would eventually end up in the sim after a long beta.

 

I could be wrong now; otherwise ED has done a great job and SiTh has passed the Turing test with ease. :)

 

Nope, all Molson and Hockey loving Canadian here... no Russian Implants...

[Yurgon]

I agree with what many have written - moderating this bunch can't be an easy job, and I wouldn't want to do it, either. ;)

 

It's also great to actually have a discussion on this topic. That's something that's been missing so far, because talking about moderation issues is usually considered against the forum rules.

 

IMO, we often get moderated out of a discussion. But when we don't get a chance to solve the problem and reach an understanding, I feel there is a lot of forced sterility to the opinions presented thereafter. I have had quite a few of my posts removed, usually because entire threads were deleted, or large parts of a heated discussion were removed. Once again, I don't envy the moderators' jobs here, but it gets frustrating to end up writing and arguing only to see it all gone a couple hours later.

 

In the German part of the forum, we saw a couple of really heated discussions with lots of name-calling, at a time when one of the most active moderators had quit. And guess what: the posters involved ignored each other for a while and then actually found a lot of common ground later on. Giving people space to sort that kind of stuff out may not be nice to look at from the host's perspective, but it can actually help create a better community.

 

Regarding the point that we can always contact a mod: After I found out that an older post of mine had been edited and most of its content removed by someone high up the chain, the mod I contacted about it never got back to me, so I'm left with a stripped post and no explanation whatsoever.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like this forum and I like the community, and most of the time I think the mods do a good job. But giving people more leeway to sort things out, being more relaxed on removing posts and locking threads would actually make it a better place IMHO.

[Wavehopper]

I've never really had any problems here. I've always found it to be a lot more mature and a whole lot less toxic than a certain site I used to frequent.

[NineLine]

Don't get me wrong, I like this forum and I like the community, and most of the time I think the mods do a good job. But giving people more leeway to sort things out, being more relaxed on removing posts and locking threads would actually make it a better place IMHO.

 

We do try and give everyone leeway, but it has to be reasonable as well, kids can and do visit this forum, and people that dont appreciate being called names, or being insulted, we have to do out best to restrict that with allowing discussions to continue, this also falls on you guys to police yourselves, if you are that mad that you have to type an insult, stop, go walk the dog, or hug your child or take out the garbage out for the wife, then come back and see if you can post without the curse word, or insult. Its a two way street, I think most of you get this though.

Edited January 10, 2017 by NineLine

[ENO]

Good to see you're still around Sith. Community is in good hands.

 

I'll undoubtedly be throwing over tables and chairs as I tuck back into mission building- but I promise I'll do it as respectfully and constructively as I can. ;)

[NineLine]

Good to see you're still around Sith. Community is in good hands.

 

I'll undoubtedly be throwing over tables and chairs as I tuck back into mission building- but I promise I'll do it as respectfully and constructively as I can. ;)

 

You do the bleeding edge stuff, so a little frustration is expected :) Glad to see you back!

[StandingCow]

Being a mod/admin is a thankless job. Thanks for all the time you guys take to make this a good place to discuss things.

[SnowTiger]

Thanks for not Banning me (yet ?) for my occasional whining !

[mkiii]

I have to say this is one of the least argumentative & calm forums I have encountered, even compared to some of the more "Professional" ones I have frequented. No doubt that is at least partly due to careful moderation, as well as the fact that we are rarely disappointed by what is going on here.

[agrasyuk]

Thanks for not Banning me (yet ?) for my occasional whining !

Banning? Jeez, I'm thankful that mods decided to not burn down my house or murder my cat for my occasional whining.

 

On a serious note though. I do realise the importance of mod team and even at present state I do feel like they do more harm then good. Just like my village municipal inspector, annoying as hell but there is a undeniable benefit of having him around.

With that , Sith, you say that you feel " . we have created a more open, mature and healthy community." . I am at loss as to what makes you feel that way. Unconcluded, perfectly polite and proper threads are still getting closed because of their topic of discussion. How is this openness? Posts above like "thanks for not banning" even if in jest are a sign of ongoing intimidation , how is this healthy? Lack of critical conversation is not maturity, it's sterilleness.

Clearly you guys use some other criteria then me to gauge openness and health. Oh well.