What does 'SAS Saturated' mean?

[Toni Carrera]

Good Afternoon Aviators, 

I was flying along yesterday, think I turned in for an offset missile shot, and on the EUFD a warning flashed up for about 5 seconds saying 'SAS Saturated'

I am assuming it is not a good thing, and if you break down the words, I guess potentially a system was overworked

I could not find anything in the manual, so just wondered what I had done wrong, or how I had overworked something, if that is what it means

Toni

[poochies]

I think it means if you had attitude hold on you were manually commanding flight controls outside the limits of the SAS control , did you have an aural warning tone as well ? 

[Toni Carrera]

I did have Attitude Hold on, and I 'think' there was a long tone, can't be sure on that though, but def had ATT Hold on

Toni

[Hiob]

SAS saturation means, that the system has reached its maximum available offset. The way the sas works is, that it offsets the position of your flight controls, via magnet coupled hydraulic actuators, but they only have a certain amount of available travel. When the offset is going in the same direction all the time (perhaps due to side winds) it will reach its maximum and can’t do anything until the middle position is reset.

You can observe, what it‘s doing with the „box“ in the controls overlay.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Hiob

[Toni Carrera]

Thank you for that detailed explanation

Much appreciated

Toni

[Rogue Trooper]

At early access, it means very little. 

I get it when coming in for a long prepared rolling landing... it does not affect my manual flight regime and is therefore ignored. It is especially annoying as I generally fly the 64D with forward trim only. Now a days I use the excellent hover hold.

When I use ATT and Alt hold, I disable them with the trim back Hat when moving to a new fire position.  

Edited May 25, 2022 by Rogue Trooper

[pii]

6 hours ago, Rogue Trooper said:

When I use ATT and Alt hold,

Has Alt hold been implemented? 

[admiki]

Not yet.

[Toni Carrera]

@Rogue Trooper How do you use those commands if they have yet to be implemented?

Just curious, as I am so waiting for the hover hold

Toni

[kgillers3]

7 hours ago, Toni Carrera said:

@Rogue Trooper How do you use those commands if they have yet to be implemented?

Just curious, as I am so waiting for the hover hold

Toni

Trim the aircraft for the speed you want using force trim release (up on the 4way hat on the cyclic) and activate the att button (trim left on the hat on the cyclic) Attitude hold will display in the UFD and your airspeed will have an indication show up around it.  > 40 kts will put it in attitude hold.  6-39 kts ground speed will put it into velocity hold.  <5 kts g/s will put it into position hold, which is essentially hover hold.  You'll manage the altitude by setting your power (collective / tq setting however you understand it).  But cyclic and heading will maintain where ever you set the position hold.  If you set it up poorly when you activate it'll bounce back and forth for a bit but it'll eventually settle down and hold that position.  

Obviously once altitude hold is implemented you can click it on and off to help you maintain your altitude. 

[Rogue Trooper]

On 5/26/2022 at 4:43 AM, pii said:

Has Alt hold been implemented? 

My Bad, I only use it to force a habit, but it does very little if nothing at all.

Alt hold will be very sweet indeed when it comes.

 

[Toni Carrera]

Indeed, very much looking forward to Alt Hold

Toni

[pii]

On 6/4/2022 at 4:16 PM, Rogue Trooper said:

My Bad, I only use it to force a habit, but it does very little if nothing at all.

Alt hold will be very sweet indeed when it comes.

 

No problem there had just been an update and I was hoping it had been. I have since found out otherwise.  

Maybe next patch.

[Lazerhawk]

Sorry for hijacking this thread, but what does the abbreviation "SAS" actually stand for? Is it the same as in the A-10, i.e. "Stability Augmentation System"?

[Hiob]

3 hours ago, Lazerhawk said:

Sorry for hijacking this thread, but what does the abbreviation "SAS" actually stand for? Is it the same as in the A-10, i.e. "Stability Augmentation System"?

Correct.

Exactly: "Stability Augmentation (Sub)System"

[Lazerhawk]

6 hours ago, Hiob said:

Correct.

Exactly: "Stability Augmentation (Sub)System"

Thank you!

[Nealius]

Has anyone been getting this warning in normal flight without any of the HOLD modes active? I typically exit ATT HOLD by tapping the trim left again, is that incorrect? I'm also occasionally getting the same aural warning tone while the EUFD doesn't have any warnings listed, except maybe center tank empty when I'm light on gas.

[TZeer]

You can still get this in normal flight. If you trim you aircraft (Force Trim Release), and operate the Apache in a way that makes the SCAS reach it's limits, you will saturate the SCAS.

Let's say you trim your Apache to fly straight. Let's say you are doing 90 knots. The SCAS is then trimmed at that spot and will assist you. Yaws, stick etc.

Now you want to decrease speed. As you loose speed, you will need to increase input on your Yaw. If you don't, the SCAS will do it for you, until the 10% limit is reached, and it's saturated.

To avoid this you can do 2 things:

1: Hold down the force trim release, until you are happy with your new inputs. Yaw, stick etc.

2: Keep tapping the force trim release as you work the pedals to give the SCAS a new center point to work from as you increase torque. Just remember to recenter the pedals between each tap, if you are using spring centered pedals with matching settings.

[stalhuth]

the alarm of this thing it's very annoying and constant 

[cthulhu68]

25 minutes ago, stalhuth said:

the alarm of this thing it's very annoying and constant 

On right console comms panel you can adjust Master Volume Control to lower it. 

[pii]

2 hours ago, stalhuth said:

the alarm of this thing it's very annoying and constant 

Yep and it seems to be going off a lot more since the last patch. It also flicks on and off over and over, good news is the ALT mode is working now. But ATT hold is doing a lot of peeping

[lefuneste01]

 

[mbits]

I've been away for a month or so and its a bit disappointing these sas issues (stability and the noise) are still present.  I changed mine to a cow moo a long time ago otherwise I would just get really irritated and turn DCS off right now for Apache. Fingers crossed its a priority to be fixed. 

Edited August 31, 2022 by mbits

[pii]

19 hours ago, mbits said:

I've been away for a month or so and its a bit disappointing these sas issues (stability and the noise) are still present.  I changed mine to a cow moo a long time ago otherwise I would just get really irritated and turn DCS off right now for Apache. Fingers crossed its a priority to be fixed. 

 

Change it to a chicken clucking sound, it works much better that way.

[Sinclair_76]

On 5/25/2022 at 11:22 PM, Rogue Trooper said:

I generally fly the 64D with forward trim only.