waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[Jayhawk1971]

vor einer Stunde schrieb Beirut:

 

You don't read French?

 

Some people... 

Actually, the most positive thing coming out of this thread (so far), is that I found out that the 3 years of French classes I had to take back in school 35+ years ago weren't completely in vain, and that - to my astonishment and amazement - I was able to actually comprehend what had been written in those posts. Well, most of it.  

Edited June 10, 2024 by Jayhawk1971

[sarumax]

This is an oportuncrisis with razbam gone I hope other good module maker can take the french aircrafts like the mirage iii, V, 2000-5 2000d/n  and see them to their completion

[afnav130]

7 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

We all hope for a good outcome, at the moment I can not say anything until the dispute is resolved. We will share more when it is possible. 

thank you 

Real problem is the lack of desire to get something done imo. What needs to be done is the principles need to meet up on a Friday, and not leave until a resolution is met. Period. Too many people just take too long to make kind of decision. A lot more would get done if this was the policy. 

[Oban]

13 minutes ago, afnav130 said:

Real problem is the lack of desire to get something done imo. What needs to be done is the principles need to meet up on a Friday, and not leave until a resolution is met. Period. Too many people just take too long to make kind of decision. A lot more would get done if this was the policy. 

LOL... Because you don't hear or see behind the scenes, and between lawyers, your perception is that there's a lack of desire...

This isn't a playground spat, where it's having a fight one day and back in the classroom the next day, and by the follow on day, they're back to being best friends.

Clearly you've never dealt with corporate lawyers !!

The entertainmant value in this thread as to how people seem to think that their knowledge and understanding of the way that things should be , compared to the way things are is mindblowing.

 

[Nightdare]

17 minutes ago, afnav130 said:

Real problem is the lack of desire to get something done imo. What needs to be done is the principles need to meet up on a Friday, and not leave until a resolution is met. Period. Too many people just take too long to make kind of decision. A lot more would get done if this was the policy. 

 

I see a lack of sense of reality from onlookers

What resolution are YOU gonna force if your opposing party isn't willing to give in? Give up?

[71st_Mastiff]

I wouldn't read to much into the issue. ED and Razbam wish for a favorable out come considering the customer support. This always pans out.

 

Who knows it might even produce more updates for other things to come...

Look on the bright side; there's plenty of other Air Craft on the way and including maps. Plenty of things to do in plenty of operations to have fun in.

 

 

[afnav130]

1 hour ago, Nightdare said:

 

I see a lack of sense of reality from onlookers

What resolution are YOU gonna force if your opposing party isn't willing to give in? Give up?

When there is no movement over something rather trivial in a lot of ways, getting the principles together sans lawyers sometimes is the best method. 

[Nightdare]

7 minutes ago, afnav130 said:

When there is no movement over something rather trivial in a lot of ways, getting the principles together sans lawyers sometimes is the best method. 

 

What you are saying is contrary to reality, the reason contracts were 'invented' in the first place, is because people either forgetting or reinterpreting their principles

[crazysundog]

I vote we lock this thread at 69 Pages!!

 

[jamie_c]

Pointless arguing who you think is right based on the EULA that comes with your copy of DCS. Eagle Dynamics can offer the product for license under any terms it sees fit to anyone, the EULA is merely the standard form agreement and anything not suitable under the terms of the EULA could in theory be negotiated, most likely in return for suitable compensation. I'd doubt third party devs operate under the EULA, more likely under the terms of an agreement more suitable to their use of the product, i.e. developing and selling third party modules for DCS World and potentially its military specific equivalent with terms including the use of any supplied tools such as EDM format plugins for DCCs or the Terrain tools.

[KoN]

Wow ™  60 pages of melt downs and last week the F4 melt down over a 24 hour delay , what's going on guys .

DCS isn't the world......... or is it .  I feel the need for speed . 

And oh ED can you please fix all the bugs that have come with 2.9 thank you . 

[MustangSally]

24 minutes ago, KoN said:

Wow ™  60 pages of melt downs and last week the F4 melt down over a 24 hour delay , what's going on guys .

DCS isn't the world......... or is it .  I feel the need for speed . 

And oh ED can you please fix all the bugs that have come with 2.9 thank you . 

What he said!

[patmath]

I am quite quiet on forums usually but this situation is starting to be frustrating. I feel like we ( the costumers) are left hanging right now. We dont know if the product will still get supported and to be honest, that is my biggest disapointement right now towards both, ED and Razbam so do I really want to keep buying product knowing what is happening when there is a disagreements? I love the Strike Eagle, never tought I would but it's been the airplane I've been flying the most in the past 6 months. ED as been really politicaly correct in their statement but we still don't know if the product will still be supported in the futur. I saw someone posting on facebook that ED does not have the codes of the SE so are we expecting a Hawk situation again? Have we been lied to that ED requested that all 3rd parties share their source codes so this situation doesn't happen again? I do not want to get refound because I really think there is some hard/good work in this airplane and even if it's not supported anymore, I enjoyed flying it but you can expect a lot of customers to be carefull with 3 parties planes and maps in the futur, well I will for sure. I think Razbam shot themself in the foot because they took their customers hostages during this disagreement between them and ED. This is just my opinion but I feel like most of us would just like to know if we should still have hope or not for the product we bought! 

[MustangSally]

...and when there's something to know, the all knowing will let you know!

[jake87ske]

vor 10 Stunden schrieb NineLine:

This is currently what we are offering for the F-15E. This is different from our normal refund policy for what is still currently a working module. We understand developments have been frozen for we have given this option for now to those who do not want to wait or stress about it. Thanks.

Will there be something similar for steam? Currently it is not possible to refund this module via steam, I tried yesterday  but it was refused because of playtime of dcs in total.

Edited June 11, 2024 by jake87ske

[Koziolek]

6 hours ago, afnav130 said:

When there is no movement over something rather trivial in a lot of ways, getting the principles together sans lawyers sometimes is the best method. 

True, but sometimes it does not work. And we have no idea if this is something trivial. IP disputes rarely are

5 hours ago, crazysundog said:

I vote we lock this thread at 69 Pages!!

 

Too late 

Edited June 11, 2024 by Koziolek

[NineLine]

1 hour ago, jake87ske said:

Will there be something similar for steam? Currently it is not possible to refund this module via steam, I tried yesterday  but it was refused because of playtime of dcs in total.

 

Sadly there is not much we can do with Steam as we have little control over it. The module still works and our goal is to keep that going and more so get it back to development. This was also stated by RB as what they wanted as well, we just need to get there 

I'm sorry I have nothing else right now, it's frustrating all around, especially for all of you.

[Romandv]

36 minutes ago, NineLine said:

Sadly there is not much we can do with Steam as we have little control over it. The module still works and our goal is to keep that going and more so get it back to development. This was also stated by RB as what they wanted as well, we just need to get there 

I'm sorry I have nothing else right now, it's frustrating all around, especially for all of you.

You could write them a letter or make arrangements, as this problem is, shall we say, not widespread? Steam, with a 2 hour and 2 week policy, of course refuses us and they are not interested in information from customers, but maybe information from ED will get results.

[falcon_120]

Ok so the post by Galinette, if true is very enlighting and shows how there is no one on the right, as always there's some truths in both sides and both sides have been involved in some wrong doing from my PoV. If i got this right:

-Razbam have been or have tried to use at some pointT DCS core engine and SDK to develop/sell professional versions of their planes to some defense forces.

-They've done so as the T&C under which DCS were written at the time did not explicitly block or prevent that use.

-ED realizing this have created a different company for their professional version of DCS, changed their T&C and have claimed some % of any transaction involving their SDK even though that may have happened under old T&C. I understand ED position as some propietary technology is being used by other companies to profit with no return for them.

-At some point the discussion between RB and ED have not arrived to any friendly agreement, and ED have withhold payments of the F15E to put pressure on RB.

-RB have made public the disagreement and the blockade to payments and stopped any support to DCS products as a response.


Any of the points above might be pure fantasy or misunderstanding from my side but if true it draws a complicated situation with a long journey to be resolved.

Meanwhile are users have been left discouraged, trapped in the middle, as we envision the possibility of having some of the best modules in DCS to be left to die a slow death.
 

Edited June 11, 2024 by falcon_120

[BIGNEWY]

31 minutes ago, Romandv said:

You could write them a letter or make arrangements, as this problem is, shall we say, not widespread? Steam, with a 2 hour and 2 week policy, of course refuses us and they are not interested in information from customers, but maybe information from ED will get results.

Sorry but we have no say with steam, they have their own policy for refunds. 

 

[IceyJones]

vor einer Stunde schrieb falcon_120:

Ok so the post by Galinette,...
 

 

yes.....that seems to sum it up pretty well......

and BECAUSE it has such a long history, everyone feels in the right. and therefor, if it goes to court, it will take YEARS to resolve

if at all

i have not much hope

meanwhile ED AGAIN only offered a store credit refund to me......when this is how ED reacts to things (ignore and be stubborn), i have even less hope

[BIGNEWY]

5 minutes ago, IceyJones said:

meanwhile ED AGAIN only offered a store credit refund to me......when this is how ED reacts to things (ignore and be stubborn), i have even less hope

they don't have to offer a refund at all but they have, the store credit is done in good will by them, it is nothing to do with being stubborn.

 

[Silver_Dragon]

Ok so the post by Galinette, if true is very enlighting and shows how there is no one on the right, as always there's some truths in both sides and both sides have been involved in some wrong doing from my PoV. If i got this right:

-Razbam have been or have tried to use at some pointT DCS core engine and SDK to develop/sell professional versions of their planes to some defense forces.

-They've done so as the T&C under which DCS were written at the time did not explicitly block or prevent that use.

-ED realizing this have created a different company for their professional version of DCS, changed their T&C and have claimed some % of any transaction involving their SDK even though that may have happened under old T&C. I understand ED position as some propietary technology is being used by other companies to profit with no return for them.

-At some point the discussion between RB and ED have not arrived to any friendly agreement, and ED have withhold payments of the F15E to put pressure on RB.

-RB have made public the disagreement and the blockade to payments and stopped any support to DCS products as a response.


Any of the points above might be pure fantasy or misunderstanding from my side but if true it draws a complicated situation with a long journey to be resolved.

Meanwhile are users have been left discouraged, trapped in the middle, as we envision the possibility of having some of the best modules in DCS to be left to die a slow death.
 

Someone missing a company called "The Battle sim" exist previously to MCS?

Enviado desde mi CPH2197 mediante Tapatalk

[felixx75]

Maybe you should continue your drama in this thread rather than start a new one here with even more speculation, conjecture, half-truths and completely false information...

https://forum.dcs.world/topic/348848-razbam-situation-what-is-the-status/

 

[addman]

18 hours ago, Nightdare said:

That has to do with people acting on incomplete information, not with transparancy

 

 

Yeah, and how do you plan to prevent that?

 

 

No, it's about contracts, trust is a nebulous thing, contracts can be enforced

 

 

Hello and welcome to reality

That car you just bought? if it's manufacturer folds, say bye-bye to spare parts (Anyone own a Saab?)

 

 

Perhaps this is the first time a contractor did this with ED, in the rest of the world it's not so rare

Just because it happens to involve you, doesn't make this special

 

It hasn't affected any product, everything RB is still "as is", you can return the F15,... or keep it

 

 

Fact: RB and ED have a dispute

That's all you have

 

Yeah, love people defending a company when they have no idea what's going on inside, what do you know that I don't? You don't seem to be aware of the already broken M2k, please read before replying. Plenty of "useful little helpers" to go around I see.