44th_Rooster Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 What you may have seen was called crazing. Crazing is very realistic and a part of real canopies especially that are aged a bit. Scratches are different when it becomes big enough to look like a distant aircraft etc (Then it is changed)....Crazing can get very bad as well but usually not bad enough to change. So for example what you might see in the FC2 canopies is what you would see if your eyeballs were actually looking at it. So that is your real world answer unless you would like more explanation. ASROCK Z77 Pro4, I5 3570K, 16GB DDR3, GTX 760SC, Corsair TX750W, Sound Blaster X-FI Extreme, Solid State Hard Drive, Full Homebuilt Cockpit, TM HOTAS Wartpig, Saitek Rudder Pedals, TrackIR-5 w/TrackClip Pro, Vizio 42inch 1080p Monitor, Windows 7 64bit [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainmaker Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 (edited) Crazing can get very bad as well but usually not bad enough to change. Mmmm... I have seen many a windscreen and a couple dozen canopy changes, with 90% of them due to crazing...so I wouldn't say that is true. Once a canopy starts to craze, it's usually only a matter of time. They don't get any better, only worse. It also depends on where it starts, a pilot has the ability to call it a safety of flight issue and then it kind of doesn't matter what the books say. Places out infront of the HUD and around the canopy bows where they have to use while on the boom are usually quick kills. Edited May 30, 2011 by Rainmaker 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cali Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 A few of my egress friends at Luke have been waiting for canopies to change because of that. i7-4820k @ 3.7, Windows 7 64-bit, 16GB 1866mhz EVGA GTX 970 2GB, 256GB SSD, 500GB WD, TM Warthog, TM Cougar MFD's, Saitek Combat Pedals, TrackIR 5, G15 keyboard, 55" 4K LED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
44th_Rooster Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 (edited) Mmmm... I have seen many a windscreen and a couple dozen canopy changes, with 90% of them due to crazing...so I wouldn't say that is true. Once a canopy starts to craze, it's usually only a matter of time. They don't get any better, only worse. It also depends on where it starts, a pilot has the ability to call it a safety of flight issue and then it kind of doesn't matter what the books say. Places out infront of the HUD and around the canopy bows where they have to use while on the boom are usually quick kills. Understood ;) I have seen many as well and I think it just depends on the climate and usage etc.... For example an F-15a that once flew with mild crazing for several years until one day at a 120 Degree Red Flag and then it progressed to have to change in 2 flights. but before that the climate it was in didn't cause it to progress for some reason. "it's usually only a matter of time." So I certainly agree with you the matter of time, but in this case it was a long time as well as many of the other birds I have touched. So perhaps one could say that it just depends on how bad the crazing is etc..... Edited June 9, 2011 by 44th_Rooster ASROCK Z77 Pro4, I5 3570K, 16GB DDR3, GTX 760SC, Corsair TX750W, Sound Blaster X-FI Extreme, Solid State Hard Drive, Full Homebuilt Cockpit, TM HOTAS Wartpig, Saitek Rudder Pedals, TrackIR-5 w/TrackClip Pro, Vizio 42inch 1080p Monitor, Windows 7 64bit [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainmaker Posted June 10, 2011 Share Posted June 10, 2011 Understood ;) I have seen many as well and I think it just depends on the climate and usage etc.... For example an F-15a that once flew with mild crazing for several years until one day at a 120 Degree Red Flag and then it progressed to have to change in 2 flights. but before that the climate it was in didn't cause it to progress for some reason. "it's usually only a matter of time." So I certainly agree with you the matter of time, but in this case it was a long time as well as many of the other birds I have touched. So perhaps one could say that it just depends on how bad the crazing is etc..... Climate is something I also didn't really think of until now...and temp can definetely effect them. So the climate of where the birds normally sit could also have a large effect on them as well. So I agree with this 100% PM answered btw... :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Canopy Scratches Poll So... it's all said in this thread: Canopy Scratches Thread But I wanted to see if anyone is really bothered with this... Being the case it's an existing feature from Lock On and Flaming Cliffs, I assume it wouldn't be that hard to implement in DSC A-10C in one of the upcoming patches (maybe as an option like "Cockpit Shadows"). How many of you would really want the canopy scratches back on your "office windows"? :D [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] ...the few, the proud, the remaining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 So you start a new thread on the same subject you linked to for what reason? v303d Fighter Group Discord | Virtual 303d Fighter Group Website | v303rd Fighter Group Twitter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
159th_Viper Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 This is pretty definitive coming from an A10C SME (subject-matter expert): To be honest the RW limits for our canopys being scratched are very tight so you normally wouldn't have any... Novice or Veteran looking for an alternative MP career? Click me to commence your Journey of Pillage and Plunder! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] '....And when I get to Heaven, to St Peter I will tell.... One more Soldier reporting Sir, I've served my time in Hell......' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 So you start a new thread on the same subject you linked to for what reason? For the reason I couldn't insert a poll in a reply... :smartass: Afraid of canopy scratches eh bro? :D [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] ...the few, the proud, the remaining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 This is pretty definitive coming from an A10C SME (subject-matter expert): I meant as an option... like the HDR rendering option, like the cockpit shadows option... like the canopy scratches i miss... :smilewink: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] ...the few, the proud, the remaining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
159th_Viper Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Afraid of canopy scratches eh bro? :D I'd hazard a guess and say IRL if the Canopy is scratched it's replaced. That said and taking into account DCS's mandate of modelling the aircraft to accord with it's RL counterpart in the strictest possible sense I'd say that it's safe to assume that we will not see canopy scratches implemented as standard. What's next, Photon torpedos? :P I meant as an option... A third-party mod, at best. Novice or Veteran looking for an alternative MP career? Click me to commence your Journey of Pillage and Plunder! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] '....And when I get to Heaven, to St Peter I will tell.... One more Soldier reporting Sir, I've served my time in Hell......' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobo Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 I'd hazard a guess and say IRL if the Canopy is scratched it's replaced. That said and taking into account DCS's mandate of modelling the aircraft to accord with it's RL counterpart in the strictest possible sense I'd say that it's safe to assume that we will not see canopy scratches implemented as standard. What's next, Photon torpedos? I don't want a scratched canopy. I would take the photon torpedoes and also like to see a Romulan cloaking device in the next patch. :P Lobo's DCS A-10C Normal Checklist & Quick Reference Handbook current version 8D available here: http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/172905/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinja Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Unrelated to the subject at hand, but I would at least to congratulate the correct (non-US) use of the phrase " I couldn't care less..." ;) i7@3.5Ghz, ATI 5870, 16GB RAM, win7 64bit, TH2GO, Track-IR, 4screen pit, TM WArthog HOTAS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyroflash Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 Canopy scratches are uncool. They ruin my nice clean glass that I love so much. If you aim for the sky, you will never hit the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostiken Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Unrelated to the subject at hand, but I would at least to congratulate the correct (non-US) use of the phrase " I couldn't care less..." ;) I'm an American and that pisses me off too :0 Every time someone at work says it I ask them just how much less they could care... [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I'm an American and that pisses me off too :0 Every time someone at work says it I ask them just how much less they could care... So I guess you wolud like to see the canopy scratches back in the sim? :smilewink: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] ...the few, the proud, the remaining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Heater_ Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 No canopy scratches ? No Party ! In the GUI option the user can toggle the scratches...very interesting Simulatori: DCS A-10C II Warthog - DCS F/A-18C Hornet - DCS F-16C - VRS F/A-18E - HOTAS: TM Warthog - Cougar \ HP Reverb G2 \ WinWing Panels Tally: I see the degenerate commie who wants to ruin our day. **Air Combat Wings** - 32nd Virtual Fighter Wing || Discord https://discord.gg/XySM5na || Twitch Segui le nostre Live! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sungsam Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Too much discussion for a MOD future ! I don't think ED must loose time with this. Community must create a MOD for people that prefer it including my self. :smilewink: DCS F16C 52+ w JHMCS ! DCS AH64D Longbow ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimebag1 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I say bring back the scratches but do them tastefully and realistically. In fc2 the scratches were highly overdone. I'm pretty sure I have seen them in several videos of cockpit footage of jets with bubble canopies and they are there, and as someone said they usually need high contrast to see them. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobek Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I say bring back the scratches but do them tastefully and realistically. Realistically? Alright, the canopy is realistic without the scratches. :) Good, fast, cheap. Choose any two. Come let's eat grandpa! Use punctuation, save lives! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguelaco Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Just my two cents. I don't understand why we are faced with this question. There are many bugs in the sim as 1.1.0.8 to even think of adding canopy scratches. There are priorities and at this stage, scratches shouldn't be on the list at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 (edited) I might be alone in liking the rendering of the not-so-perfect canopy in previous DCS titles but I miss the little scratches in the A-10C canopy. Is there a way to enable this effect again or do I put it on the whishlist? Cheers A few captures just to make you all remeber what a beautiful little feature are we talking about: :thumbup: P.S. I just noticed how if one replies to this thread, it doesn't come up anymore as one of the last posts below the first page stickies... what's that about? Media control... :D:D:D Edited June 16, 2011 by Aries noticed something weird... [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] ...the few, the proud, the remaining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BimC Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 I understand that the matter has been brought forward several times. On the other hand, I AGREE with the fact that there are far more important things to have in place before this. Suggest you enable it is an option to turn on or off. Personally, I think the effect enhanced the feeling of being airborne and having distance to the ground. Among several other things, it was one of the details I took notice of as I first became acquainted with Lock On. I miss them, though it is not the first thing to consider. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] _________________________________________________ WIN 10, i7-2600K at 3.4ghz, 2x OCZ Vertex 120GB SSD RAID 0, Corsair Vengeance 16GB, Gainward GeForce GTX 590, Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog, Track IR 5 PRO. DCS 1.5.3.52724.74 - DCS 2.0.2.52369 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MustangSally Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Sorry Aries, but I totally disagree. Realism demands no crazing (scratches). Just as a side note, I never in my twenty years RAAF service as an Aircraft Tech came across crazed (scratched) canopies or windscreens on "serviceable" aircraft. Ryzen 9 7950X3D - MSI MAG X670E TomaHawk MB, ASUS ROG Ryujin III 360 AIO 64gig Corsair DDR5@6000, Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4090 AORUS Winwing Super Taurus, Orion2, TO / Combat panels, Collective with Topgun MIP Winwing Skywalker pedals, NLR Boeing Mil Edition Simpit, Trackir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostiken Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 There are 'scratches' in all canopies. They're not really scratches, but when looking at a bright light source there's is clearly, on all canopies both new and old, circular-patterned lines. The thing is, these lines are incredibly faint and you would not normally see them as your eye would be focused far beyond them. The canopy 'scratches' shown in the pictures above are a little excessive since, due to the nature of the game we see everything in-focus. An A-10 more than likely has far stricter standards than an F-15E but I can see fine lines on every single canopy, even those about to be installed when an old one was to be removed, so to say that all canopies are more finely polished than the Hubble telescope's primary mirror is a little disingenuous. It would be a neat gee-whiz feature but probably not worth the time. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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