Anti-skid behavior

[Baz000]

My Viper typically wants to pull to one side when I am braking during the landing roll out. I decided to do a fast run down the runway to test this out and I used the W key on the keyboard instead of my toe brakes on my rudder pedals and still the same results.

 

Is the anti skid braking is not working properly on the F-16?

 

Have a video I recorded and a track wasn't my best landing, I ended up bouncing on touchdown initially.

 

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1V-2OajKToC9rrONgNe6k8ejHfwZl0Ekz/view?usp=sharing

Edited August 31, 2020 by Baz000

[stormrider]

 

Is the anti skid braking is not working properly on the F-16?

 

 

Among other things.

[mvsgas]

My Viper typically wants to pull to one side when I am braking during the landing roll out.

 

The real aircraft is suppose to want to drift right with NWS off as describe in the USAF manual 1F-16CJ-1, Form 15 August 2009, page 2-27, last note.

[Dee-Jay]

Is the anti skid braking is not working properly on the F-16?

 

It is not working at all.

[BuzzU]

Using the W key is like slamming on the toe brakes. Not the best way to stop. How come you don't turn on NS? You have no low speed control without it.

[Swift.]

Using the W key is like slamming on the toe brakes. Not the best way to stop. How come you don't turn on NS? You have no low speed control without it.

 

To highlight the effect

[Bouli306]

The real aircraft is suppose to want to drift right with NWS off as describe in the USAF manual 1F-16CJ-1, Form 15 August 2009, page 2-27, last note.

 

That is only with NWS off or fail or hydraulic B failure and only at low speeds.

Edited September 1, 2020 by Bouli306

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

What also doesn't help, is that the toe brake power is not linear currently: I set a -20 curve (since we still need to set the wheel brakes as "inverted"), to make it smoother, and easier to gradually increase brake pressure.

[mvsgas]

That is only with NWS off or fail or hydraulic B failure and only at low speeds.

 

I did mention NWS off. But it is at any speed with increase nose loading; which include breaking, TGP installed or if they used forward stick pressure. I know because every time we got new pilots or pilot not used to flying the block 40 we get NWS pulls to the right wright up. But I was told repeatedly that we (maintainers) don't use -1 for maintenance. We could not CND write ups so here we go troubleshooting brakes and NWS, finding nothing but having to change a part no matter what, normally the NWS potentiometer.

 

Same thing would happen with "external tank slow to feed" or on the late 1990, on PW engine with AB no light MFL.

 

All of this if irrelevant in DCS unless this is model at some point.

[BuzzU]

To highlight the effect

 

I understand the anti-skid isn't right but it's not that hard to stop the Viper without locking up the wheels. The video makes it look worse than it is. We can keep it stopping straight the same way we did with our cars before anti-lock brakes. Actually, it's easier in a plane because we have left-right brakes.

[VampireNZ]

Don't forget you will also want to weather-cock into the wind if you have any crosswind.

 

But yes you need to not brake at 100%, and just use differential braking when slowing to keep straight.

[Baz000]

there is a track there for viewing pleasure too

[Muddy17]

In Short, the breaks are crap.can stop faster in the space shuttle.

[QuiGon]

In Short, the breaks are crap.can stop faster in the space shuttle.

The Space Shuttle had drag chutes (and so do some export Vipers)...

[BuzzU]

They used left over brakes from the Ford Model A for the Viper.

[Zergburger]

try holding full aft stick, this will put more downforce on the maingear and should theoretically allow for harder braking.

[TheLazyGator]

Its abit weird under braking

[Baz000]

anything about the anti-skidding not actually anti-skidding? Its like driving a car with anti-lock brakes but when you need them your wheel locks lol

[Frag]

Hi guys,

 

I landed hundreds (if not thousands) of time with many aircraft so I am quite comfortable with this .... but the F-16 still does give me the chill while landing.  It is difficult for me to believe that the aircraft really behave this way... pilots would HATE this. 

 

That thing feels like a 1200 hp drag car with tinny tire ...it skids all over the place. Was this thing fixed in the beta branch (I am on stable)? The thread is quite old so maybe something was done in the meantime.

 

Also dumb question but, is the Anti-Skid feature must be activated thru a switch?

[Rudel_chw]

1 hour ago, Frag said:

That thing feels like a 1200 hp drag car with tinny tire ...it skids all over the place. Was this thing fixed in the beta branch (I am on stable)? The thread is quite old so maybe something was done in the meantime.

you need to aerobrake before thinking of using the wheelbrakes, here is a recent and very clear tutorial on this:

 

 

[=52d= Skip]

14 hours ago, Frag said:

Hi guys,

 

I landed hundreds (if not thousands) of time with many aircraft so I am quite comfortable with this .... but the F-16 still does give me the chill while landing.  It is difficult for me to believe that the aircraft really behave this way... pilots would HATE this. 

 

That thing feels like a 1200 hp drag car with tinny tire ...it skids all over the place. Was this thing fixed in the beta branch (I am on stable)? The thread is quite old so maybe something was done in the meantime.

 

Also dumb question but, is the Anti-Skid feature must be activated thru a switch?

 

 

Not much has changed since then, thus I´d consider the whole Anti-Skid implementation as a "Work in Progress"

[Frag]

7 hours ago, =52d= Skip said:

 

 

Not much has changed since then, thus I´d consider the whole Anti-Skid implementation as a "Work in Progress"

 

Good! At least we know that some work will be done in this area. I find quite ironic to be more nervous landing my F-16 than flying it few minutes before over a city infested with SAM sites. LOL

[ruddy122]

You are not alone

Flying and Fighting in the F-16 is great

Rollout I sweat not to tip over or hit the ils antenna or excessive sink rate which puts the gear through the wings or damaging the gear on takeoff

Is the real viper that much work?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bas.T]

16 hours ago, ruddy122 said:

You are not alone

Flying and Fighting in the F-16 is great

Rollout I sweat not to tip over or hit the ils antenna or excessive sink rate which puts the gear through the wings or damaging the gear on takeoff

Is the real viper that much work?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Judging by how they work the approach here in the netherlands, you quite often hear engine's spooling up on short final to correct the sink rate so I'd say so yeah. I think besides the anti skid behavior the way it brakes and lands is as it should be.

[darkman222]

They are still working on anti skid. I think it will be a big improvement, once finished. I have rudder pedals with toe breakes. Just dont push the brakes further than 2/3rd of the pedal travel and trying to balance out if the jet wants to go to either side. Its just a workaround, but it is what we have at the moment.

Of course you need aerobraking but slower than 100 kts you'd have to be an ice skater until we finally have ABS.

 

For even more fun: Wait until ED models damage of the nozzle and the engine when you're aerobraking too much and the lower fuselage of the aircraft touches the runway

Edited May 7, 2021 by darkman222