No BIG updates on FRIDAYS anymore please.

[jejsus]

The title says it all.

[Rudel_chw]

You can omit the update if you want and do it on Monday or whenever you want .. just click on that "Later" button ... let the rest of us have the update as soon as its available 

 

 

[jejsus]

It breaks the weekend plans for the people with slower internet connection since many times updated servers are not visible to non-updated clients, so they can't engage in squad trainings, and for some the multiplayer weekend is gone as they have to run update for 24-48h... But you can continue your selfish and ignorant button theory mr.Rudel.

[Rudel_chw]

3 minutes ago, jejsus said:

But you can continue your selfish and ignorant button theory mr.Rudel.

Sorry I didn’t think of the correct motive behind your wish … will keep out of your way from now on

 

[Art-J]

@jejsus First of all, you didn't bother to exlain / justify your request in your original half-a$$ed post, so Rudel's advice was valid. Second - what about all people who actually can and want to update and run their servers on Friday, just in time for the weekend when most playing takes place? Why should they all have to wait for you, who clearly are selfish and ignorant here? 

Yes, some people with slower connections will have to wait longer, just like people with Stable version will probably have to wait for new content until January. It is what it is.

[jejsus]

5 minutes ago, Art-J said:

@jejsus First of all, you didn't bother to exlain / justify your request in your original half-a$$ed post, so Rudel's advice was valid. Second - what about all people who actually can and want to update and run their servers on Friday, just in time for the weekend when most playing takes place? Why should they all have to wait for you, who clearly are selfish and ignorant here? 

Yes, some people with slower connections will have to wait longer, just like people with Stable version will probably have to wait for new content until January. It is what it is.

You are turning it into a competition of who can and can't update faster, while my intention is for all to enjoy a gameplay as used to, trough the weekend, not excluding any participants, while you intend to leave people behind, which is even worse than being selfish, it's actually malicious. 

The non-explanatory argument here is on point. I apologize for that and am sorry I posted in anger, should take more time to consider all options and apetittes, but still don't regret it.

[Furiz]

Guys calm down,

 

as I come from the caveman internet gang I totally understand this request (my download time spent was 5 hrs), but I completely understand ED too, they can't time their updates to everyone needs, so that Later button is the right choice.

[cfrag]

1 hour ago, jejsus said:

You are turning it into a competition of who can and can't update faster, while my intention is for all to enjoy a gameplay as used to, trough the weekend, not excluding any participants, while you intend to leave people behind, which is even worse than being selfish, it's actually malicious.

Except that I feel that you are 

a) forcing everyone to conform to the lowest common denominator (which happens to coincide with yours, what about that), and even worse 

b) you assume that everyone is like you and plays on week-ends. I work on week-ends, and your proposal seems selfish to anyone who isn't observing some arcane occidental custom where Sundays are non-working days. 

In short, your proposal sounds to me that you feel inconvenienced by a Friday release and think it's fine that that everyone else should put off their updates so you can play on week-ends. Please forgive me when I say that the word "selfish" does come to my mind when I look at it that way.

Edited December 17, 2022 by cfrag

[jejsus]

Most squadroons that I know for have trainings on friday evenings. I'm comming from that, not from my own perspective or selfishness... They sure are not satisfied with having to wait for members to update 20gigs and unpack 65gigs, I know from experience. 4ship becomes 3 or 2ship. I'm not forcing my priorities here, I just want to let the developers know that it's not practical for the MP community. And if you do a wide-scale research on when squads have trainings, you will confirm on what I'm talking about here. So no need to come back at me with a change of a schedule and these kind of proposals as it doesn't work in real life.  

I am also questioning how legit replies from members with 1500+ posts are, as if I count in typing + updating, there's very little time for flying hours.

[Hoirtel]

If you need to be in control that much, have you own server. Other than that we all just have to deal with things as they come...as with the rest of life. It's not like it's every Friday, once in a couple of months maybe? 

[cfrag]

1 minute ago, jejsus said:

as if I count in typing + updating, there's very little time for flying hours

Get a better keyboard?  - I've got another one coming for you: I also fit in mission development, sharing them, and documenting them. Not everything in the world is as you would like it. If my squad trains on Fridays and I'm off working, that's tough on me. If you can't participate because your server is still updating - tough on you. Mitigation is obvious, and if you can't see how I fit typing messages and playing DCS into my busy schedule I sure as hell can't see why a server would take 24h-48h for updates. My server host (the kind people at Fox3) had all servers (some 100?) updated within a two hour time frame; their longest update window (when SA came out) was 6 hours. Forcing everyone to follow behind the weakest links because you happen to be inconvenienced by them evokes very little sympathy on my side. So you can't play for a week-end on your favorite servers because they are slow to update. And your resolution for that is - seriously - everyone else (who can play) should wait. So you can have fun. Right. That's not selfish at all.

[Cab]

I feel like this tread should win an award of some kind. 

[jejsus]

14 minutes ago, cfrag said:

Get a better keyboard?  - I've got another one coming for you: I also fit in mission development, sharing them, and documenting them. Not everything in the world is as you would like it. If my squad trains on Fridays and I'm off working, that's tough on me. If you can't participate because your server is still updating - tough on you. Mitigation is obvious, and if you can't see how I fit typing messages and playing DCS into my busy schedule I sure as hell can't see why a server would take 24h-48h for updates. My server host (the kind people at Fox3) had all servers (some 100?) updated within a two hour time frame; their longest update window (when SA came out) was 6 hours. Forcing everyone to follow behind the weakest links because you happen to be inconvenienced by them evokes very little sympathy on my side. So you can't play for a week-end on your favorite servers because they are slow to update. And your resolution for that is - seriously - everyone else (who can play) should wait. So you can have fun. Right. That's not selfish at all.

Keyboard? Thanks, im not a gear junkie, but I can buy you one, as you will definitely need it, there is a lot of muscle memory to use till you reach 10000 important posts.

We are fighting over something that we wouldn't have to if id didn't came into existance yesterday evening (my time). it totaly ruined my flying night (and i know im not alone), but I'm happy for all the lost souls to whom waiting to trigger that update button is more important that flying a normaly functional simulator with their buddies. Trough the weekend.

So dear mr. Mission developer, I wish you happy bug tracking and reporting troughout the weekend, that only you can enjoy.

And you didn't need to use this thread for promotion.

[Bremspropeller]

1 hour ago, jejsus said:

Most squadroons that I know for have trainings on friday evenings. I'm comming from that, not from my own perspective or selfishness... They sure are not satisfied with having to wait for members to update 20gigs and unpack 65gigs, I know from experience. 4ship becomes 3 or 2ship. I'm not forcing my priorities here, I just want to let the developers know that it's not practical for the MP community.

Not trying to be a smartass here, but the easiest way around this would be a squadron policy that there are to be no updates on fridays, so all members have a chance to load the update in time.

I don't see a reason why taking everybody else hostage should be the best possible solution.

[HC_Official]

1 minute ago, Bremspropeller said:

Not trying to be a smartass here, but the easiest way around this would be a squadron policy that there are to be no updates on fridays, so all members have a chance to load the update in time.

I don't see a reason why taking everybody else hostage should be the best possible solution.

Yep, work this stuff out with squadron buddies / your server admin and all will be well

[jejsus]

Thank you for your constructive replies. This would function in the case if squad owns their own server. In my experience there was always atleast one who even accidentaly pushed the button and we had to revert him. In this case even gui revert option whould make things easier, not having to point people to command line. 

[HC_Official]

that skatezilla fella has a GUI updater controller type program that can make this stuff a bit easier for those folks who are not good wit command line stuff

[snowman[FR]]

Downloaded last update in 8 minutes, doesn't feel ashame.

[Baldrick33]

The risk of a Friday release is always going to be the limited resources over the weekend to fix any real showstoppers. That said rolling back isn't exactly the hardest of challenges, just a bit frustrating and time consuming if it goes horribly wrong

The vast majority of DCS players play single player so most would welcome shiny new stuff for the weekend when they typically have the most time to play.

Having patches delayed for an Open Beta program for client run multiplayer events makes little sense to me. The server owners have complete control over the version they run and a simple process of go/no go is all that is needed. Heck we did it in online sim racing leagues over two decades ago with Grand Prix Legends and dial up modems!

 

[Evoman]

This whole thread should be a good learning example of why you should always provide as much information as possible in the original post to get a quick no fuss acceptance or fix.

When someone seeks help about a PC, Windows or other program issue in the IT forums they always usually provide all pertaining info and screen out put of the errors so that the problem can be resolved as quick as possible.

[jejsus]

23 minutes ago, Evoman said:

This whole thread should be a good learning example of why you should always provide as much information as possible in the original post to get a quick no fuss acceptance or fix.

I agree to some extent, that being it should not serve only for this reason, but maybe being provocative might help multiplayer community, as it seems we are the minority and our problems not taken into account many times. quoting:

1 hour ago, Baldrick33 said:

The vast majority of DCS players play single player so most would welcome shiny new stuff for the weekend when they typically have the most time to play.

... so as much as I regret it, it might be necessary to scream and to provoke more on this topic.  Not solving issues as a whole creates opposing interests right away. I don't think it's the right way, more like an excuse. While the solution mentioned above solves the problem only for entirely closed community it still does not solve the problem for the groups that are engaging on random servers. At least ED could announce the update in advance so that mission planners could reorganize. Maybe it's not possible for other reasons, idk. 

[Baldrick33]

16 minutes ago, jejsus said:

... so as much as I regret it, it might be necessary to scream and to provoke more on this topic.  Not solving issues as a whole creates opposing interests right away. I don't think it's the right way, more like an excuse. While the solution mentioned above solves the problem only for entirely closed community it still does not solve the problem for the groups that are engaging on random servers. At least ED could announce the update in advance so that mission planners could reorganize. Maybe it's not possible for other reasons, idk. 

The biggest issue is the fact the vast majority of the multiplayer community has adopted Open Beta as a standard. I am sure there are many historically good reasons but it is in conflict with the whole concept of an open beta where there are frequent updates and stuff regularly gets broken to some degree.

Now it seems the multiplayer community have accepted the risks and the benefits of the latest beta version with fixes to imbalances, new features and the latest aircraft updates outweigh using the stable version and they deal with the challenges of version control and occasional "bad" update that needs a hotfix.

IMHO the responsibility lays squarely with the multiplayer community to manage their beta installs and the lack of consensus with your post suggests they don't see it as ED's job to bend over backwards for them at the expense of the wider user base.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Baldrick33

[SharpeXB]

Seems like an issue for squads that want to run missions on Friday nights. 
I wasn’t even aware that updates always come on Fridays. 
Get your squad to recognize that downloads might take time for some of their members. Or get faster Internet. Anymore having broadband Internet is a vital feature in life. Especially in gaming. 

10 hours ago, jejsus said:

for some the multiplayer weekend is gone as they have to run update for 24-48h

Seriously?! You need faster service then. And DCS is the least of your troubles. 

[maxTRX]

3 hours ago, snowman[FR] said:

Downloaded last update in 8 minutes, doesn't feel ashame.

Mine took few more, can't complain.  At one point it was showing 108% of dl completed... not bad  No extra goodies showing up yet :/

[jejsus]

1 hour ago, Baldrick33 said:

The biggest issue is the fact the vast majority of the multiplayer community has adopted Open Beta as a standard. I am sure there are many historically good reasons but it is in conflict with the whole concept of an open beta where there are frequent updates and stuff regularly gets broken to some degree.

Now it seems the multiplayer community have accepted the risks and the benefits of the latest beta version with fixes to imbalances, new features and the latest aircraft updates outweigh using the stable version and they deal with the challenges of version control and occasional "bad" update that needs a hotfix.

IMHO the responsibility lays squarely with the multiplayer community to manage their beta installs and the lack of consensus with your post suggests they don't see it as ED's job to bend over backwards for them at the expense of the wider user base.

 

Not true, there is no stable version in DCS. Let the professional explain it to you :

 

And to put us 12-24 months behind the newest release as a solution, seems absurd to me. Other metrics should be also adjusted then, for even considering to take this kind of a step-back.

 

39 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Seems like an issue for squads that want to run missions on Friday nights. 
I wasn’t even aware that updates always come on Fridays. 
Get your squad to recognize that downloads might take time for some of their members. Or get faster Internet. Anymore having broadband Internet is a vital feature in life. Especially in gaming. 

Seriously?! You need faster service then. And DCS is the least of your troubles. 

 Another too-narrow approach for my taste. You don't need a very fast internet connection to play multiplayer and even in the very brief/unthorough initial post I managed to squeeze BIG updates in there as an issue.