reported MT freezes even in main menu

[BIGNEWY]

6 minutes ago, Yodeling said:

Frankly, I don't understand how this is possible.  I won't presume to understand the complexities of debugging a complex game engine, but as someone who fixed thousands of bugs over several decades (even multithreading bugs), it never took me more than a few days to pinpoint an issue, and no more than a week or two to fix it (usually a couple hours).  The only time I couldn't fix a bug quickly is if:  A) I couldn't reproduce it, or B) It wasn't priority.  I find it hard to believe that after many months this issue cannot be reproduced, especially since this seems to be pretty consistent with every 12th/13th/14th gen Intel CPU in stock configuration, and it can be reproduced by literally launching the game and sitting in the main menu.  Which leads me to believe that the problem is option B

It is ok not to understand the complexity of what the team is doing, it isnt a discussion for this thread. The team are back from their break working on their tasks and when we have news to share about improvements and tweaks we will share it. 

thanks

[AstonMartinDBS]

I don't use any of the known workarounds since several weeks and the MT version of DCS runs fine in about 10 to 20 sessions, but at some random point the issue occurs again. I wasn't able to find out any pattern for the appearance of the issue so far. Sometimes it appears even after a cold started system.

For this reason I can understand, that it is hard for the team to address the issue.

Edited January 17 by AstonMartinDBS

[Sr.]

I have noticed somewhat of a pattern.

Loading any F-15E mission happens in about 1/3 the time as any other. And once that first initial mission loads, exit and start any of mission (or map) and it loads in seconds.

Any module beyond that, loads as slow as if it I had emptied the metashader2 and fxo folders. Often 10-15 minutes. UNLESS I first load/exit a couple F-15E missions... then even the other modules load faster than "normal."

 

Coincidentally, for me anyway this slow to load behavior seems to have started the same week the F-15E was pre-released. 

[speed-of-heat]

For me the thing I have been observing is in the f18 free flight ia in Syria, first load always gives poor performance  18-22 fps for the first few seconds of play  and then intermittent there after, the second load in a session is absolutely fine, it's completely smooth  and normal frametimes, I reload dcs and back to the same opening behavior as Sr said its sort of llike it is regenerating the shaders...

[YoYo]

As I wrote earlier, the problem completely disappeared for me (Windows 10, HT=on)) after unparking all cores. I have had absolutely no problem with this for over 1.5 months and it has never, ever occurred again. If you haven't done it, I advise you to try it, it requires changing the plan in the registry (there is a separate topic about it) but it helped 100%. Of course, that doesn't mean ED shouldn't treat this as a priority, as it's a pretty serious and common game engine optimization problem.

[speed-of-heat]

all my cores are unparked ... and have been forever but i checked and yes they are still unparked 

[AstonMartinDBS]

9 hours ago, speed-of-heat said:

in the f18 free flight ia in Syria, first load always gives poor performance  18-22 fps for the first few seconds of play  

FYI: I've tested the IA free flight mission at Syria right now and had absolutely no issues.

[speed-of-heat]

1 hour ago, AstonMartinDBS said:

FYI: I've tested the IA free flight mission at Syria right now and had absolutely no issues.

anyone who doesn't understand why this is "not simple to fix" ... this is why 

[IRRE_Schwarzy]

HI, I have the same problems as all of you, since about this summer (july I think), a few months before the 2.9 and it becoms worse with 2.9.

Sometimes 0  fps just in the menu, as well on screen as on VR. I tried a new install, exactly the same. I tried unparking the core of my CPU, and I can say that it is very better (I had half of my core who were parked).

Since that, my menu is very fluid, but I have only one big problem, that is very random : sometimes on a mission (single or multiplayer as well), I can have no issu, with about 60 fps in VR, and sometimes I have big falls of FPS, and I have it only when I am looking the ground or the horizon : 20 FPS eyes to the ground, 75 fps eyes to the sky. Some times the problem disappear a few mminutes after, sometimes I have it all the missions, sometimes I dont have it. I have this problem on all maps, but especially on Caucase (and very less on Syria).

My systeme : i7 12700 KF, rtx 3080, 64 GB DDR5, Headset HP reverb G2.
My 12 e gen cpu tells me that I can have the same problems as lots of you.

Edited January 19 by IRRE_Schwarzy

[YoYo]

1 hour ago, IRRE_Schwarzy said:

HI, I have the same problems as all of you, since about this summer (july I think), a few months before the 2.9 and it becoms worse with 2.9.

It could be, the issue appeared in June 2022 but only for 12xxx and 13xxx CPU (+some models of AMD), after 2.9 it started affecting most processors.

[eror85]

Hi ALL!

Finally and gladly i can confirm, that cpu core unparking is solve my multithread stuttering issue!!!

Before that solution nothing helped me... i tried to disable the 100% core, tried with windows 10 and 11, nothing helped.

But not long ago i read somewhere in dcs forum that maybe cpu unparking might work.

I tried the "regedit version". Iam using windows 11, my cpu is 13700KF.

It works for 1,5 weeks without a single stutter!

[YoYo]

9 minutes ago, eror85 said:

Hi ALL!

Finally and gladly i can confirm, that cpu core unparking is solve my multithread stuttering issue!!!

Yes, this is the best option so far, no issue after this for me (I did it 2,5 months ago). 13900K so looks like for this CPU line is the best option.

[raven06a]

I'm sad to report that stuttering came back and I'm stuck with a "CPU BOUND (rendering thread)" I hadn't seen in months.

Literally didn't even use the computer for 25 days as I was on vacations lol.

Cores unparked, Bignewy's mt.lua file present, clean Metashaders2 and FXO folders, and basically all the fixes I used when the problems first came up are applied. Same settings as before.

Worth to mention that I did had both windows 11 and nvidia drivers updates.

For context, I'm running an i7 12700, 32gb ram, running on a dedicated SSD and a 3070 which is normally the bottle neck on VR (I never really do play 2d, and even then I'm getting the same CPU Bound thingy).

Log attached in case I'm missing something.

Edit: did a slow repair to no avail. I'll see what happens after today's update.

Edit 2 (post Feb22th Update): Clean nvidia drivers installation, cleared nvidia cache, updated dcs, cleared FXO, metashaders2, restarted PC, restarted headset, tinkered with some options on nvidia control panel (after going back to default profile). Now I'm only getting CPU bound on menus but on gameplay I'm getting stable fps with a few rendering spikes here and there most noticeable on persian gulf. Still weird and not entirely satisfied but at least it's playable again. New log attached just in case. 

dcs.log

post update dcs.log

Edited February 22 by raven06a

[Zebra1-1]

I don't feel like reading through this entire thread again, but it seems like this is tied mainly to the hybrid CPUs.

I have a i7 11700K and don't have these issues. 

I see a LOT of members in this thread have 12th and 13th gen Intel CPUs. I'm not up to date on the AMD side, so can't speak to that.  

Edited February 24 by Zebra1-1

[71st_Mastiff]

the BIN dcs exe will not start in vr for me, I have to use the bin-mt dcs exe.

 

 

[Rapierarch]

12 hours ago, Zebra1-1 said:

I don't feel like reading through this entire thread again, but it seems like this is tied mainly to the hybrid CPUs.

I have a i7 11700K and don't have these issues. 

I see a LOT of members in this thread have 12th and 13th gen Intel CPUs. I'm not up to date on the AMD side, so can't speak to that.  

 

I had it with 3950x

[Ecnatalausio]

I've tested the new update for about an hour.

This time I never had to hard reset or wait half hours for the computer to unfreeze.

After the last update the "stuttering with full machine lock" problem has almost gone. It happened only one time for a few moments exiting a mission and entering the main menu.

Now I experience freezes each time the engine has to load some asset and each time I open a menu or change screen.

Between the freezes the game plays very fluidly, this time the difference with the single threaded version is very apparent, really excellent. Not only in flight but also in the mission editor.

Unfortunately every time some models have to be loaded it's a 10 - 30 seconds stall. For example, in the mission editor, loadout screen, every time I choose a bomb or missile that was not loaded yet.

I got a minute freeze opening the options menu, during flight, to adjust the volume. After a while it unfreezes and works perfectly.

I also get this freezes before starting a mission and generally when switching program modes.

Intel I9 12gen 5Ghz, 64Gb Ram, Nvidia RTX 3090Ti, all drives SSD, M2 dedicated to DCS

 

 

 

[Dogo]

Hello people.
My problem is the same as most, since 2.9 came out I have stuttering in the main menu and it is impossible to move the mouse, having to kill the DCS process. Sometimes it is solved by restarting the Sim or PC several times. It also sometimes freezes during the flight for between 30 and 60 seconds.
I have already tried everything they put in the comments and it remains the same, to the point that I already feel frustration and it is impossible for me to continue flying with my squadron.
I clarify that it is the only game I have problems with.
I attach my PC data.
Intel Core I7 12700KF
DDR4 64GB
GeForce RTX 3070 TI
M2 disk
If anyone knows what it could be, I would appreciate your help.
Greetings.

 

[Brigg]

are you ryzen users still diabling SMT in the bios and disabling core 8 or isnt it needed now?

[Sr.]

4 hours ago, Brigg said:

are you ryzen users still diabling SMT in the bios and disabling core 8 or isnt it needed now?

Never have. Don't intend to.

[Kobymaru]

The issue is still there for me with 2.9.3. At least core 8 trick still works, but I'm getting a bit tired of it, ngl.

Any news on this? Still a bit boggled by the lack of updates for an issue that affects many players on newer-gen CPUs.

[Sr.]

This may sound crazy but, here it goes.

 

I stumbled on this completely by accident. I have found if I have Quick CPU running, and either before or just after selecting a mission to start, then Alt/Tab to Quick CPU, move the core parking slider even just a touch, then click Apply then move it back/apply... no more waiting 5-10 minutes for a mission to load.

It also will force the system to resume in those instance when the CPU seems to be doing nothing, as evident by the fans slowing to nothing.

 

null

Edited March 9 by Sr.

[Gripen 4-1]

Tested again today:

• with SMT / Hyperthreading  on still stuttering
• with SMT /Hyperthreading off in BIOS much better

with the last update the performance  / framerate got better for me. But for me it still seems, that there is a problem with SMT / Hyperthreading on or core /thread scheduling.

Don't know why, but with DCS SMT is a no go for me.

[Chief_Biv]

For me with 12900 CPU - I have HT on and have forced unparking of all cores. Stuttering problem solved with this. I still have a problem with the game hanging when starting a mission. I work around this by alt-tab out of DCS, then trigger an action in another app (browser) and almost immediately DCS loads the mission or briefing in the background. Without alt-tab in and out I can wait for minutes. This is still the case in the latest patch. It’s been this way since MT was introduced.

[Sr.]

On 3/10/2024 at 4:22 AM, Chief_Biv said:

For me with 12900 CPU - I have HT on and have forced unparking of all cores. Stuttering problem solved with this. I still have a problem with the game hanging when starting a mission. I work around this by alt-tab out of DCS, then trigger an action in another app (browser) and almost immediately DCS loads the mission or briefing in the background. Without alt-tab in and out I can wait for minutes. This is still the case in the latest patch. It’s been this way since MT was introduced.

Yep, I threaten it by opening task manager... by the time I'm about to click End Task... viola, opens.