waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[Pipe]

I don’t like this situation anymore than anyone else, but…
Nobody in the free world works for free, there are terms for it though..slavery or charity take your pick. 
None of the third party devs are in these categories

[Wizard_03]

10 minutes ago, Snappy said:

I‘m saying by buying from ED store and accepting their EULA you put yourself in a very bad position for a legal argument, not least from a practical point of view as well.

Be my guest to try, I will happily congratulate you if you manage to win.

Unfortunately you will likely also have to front much more money than the module price for the legal bills.( the above mentioned practical pov)

 

Several big time gaming studios in the industry have put forth similar arguments in court and lost.

But you are right my mistake was letting my enthusiasm for airplanes get the best of me. I would hope others read these posts and learn the same lesson regardless of what happens in this particular situation.

Now what I can't understand is defending practices like that. At the end of the day it's taking advantage of people, and that's wrong. People should be held accountable for their actions. The fact that the same people who cry foul when Ron makes accusations against ED can somehow turn off their high morality and have no sympathy for the customers that have also been wronged is unbelievable to me. Nor can I understand defending razbam's strike based on nothing more then Ron's word. But too each their own I guess. 

[NineLine]

Hey guys I know it's incredibly frustrating but the powers that be are working on it. Let's not get carried away with theories and or villainizing either side, let's keep to the rules and support everyone to get back to the status quo so we can get back to SE goodness. 

[Snappy]

38 minutes ago, Wizard_03 said:

Several big time gaming studios in the industry have put forth similar arguments in court and lost.

But you are right my mistake was letting my enthusiasm for airplanes get the best of me. I would hope others read these posts and learn the same lesson regardless of what happens in this particular situation.

Now what I can't understand is defending practices like that. At the end of the day it's taking advantage of people, and that's wrong. People should be held accountable for their actions. The fact that the same people who cry foul when Ron makes accusations against ED can somehow turn off their high morality and have no sympathy for the customers that have also been wronged is unbelievable to me. Nor can I understand defending razbam's strike based on nothing more then Ron's word. But too each their own I guess. 

Do you have a link to those lost legal trials? I’d be really interested in the details.

I‘m not sure if you were talking about me, but if you were you misunderstood me. I’m not defending this. I was pointing out the situation and yes in a way it’s also a bit on the customer due to buying into EA and the EULA as mentioned.

But - I also much dislike this very skewed business landscape that’s based on good-faith purchases on the customer side and difficult -to-enforce vague obligations to deliver product side for the company in actuality.

I think there only very few good options left.I recommend being careful in the future which companies still to entrust with up-front money, if at all.

I made my decision in that regardaccordingly and some parties have simply gambled away my trust as a customer.

Edited May 10, 2024 by Snappy

[nessuno0505]

Just one consideration: after the first stages of the affair, in which ED moderators closed all the posts in which it was enough to mention this matter, now they are intervening in a very soft way in a topic in which every possible and imaginable rule has been broken: there has been talk of other simulators, inferences have been made about the commercial and legal implications of the matter, there have been flames among users and so on. I think they're probing the mood of the community, so they can predict how we'll react when the end of this story (whatever it is, but I fear not a good one) will be told.

Edited May 10, 2024 by nessuno0505

[Ironmants726]

Well, this entire thread is eye opening to the fact that a lot of people on either side of the argument are too immature to be in here replying to anyone. I came here hoping to get some kind of idea if the thing I just paid for is dead or not and what I found was people arguing about everything. I am just going to consider RAZBAM DCS Modules DEAD until I hear something official. Going to go fly the Viper now, hope you all have a great day!

[Gizmo03]

vor 54 Minuten schrieb nessuno0505:

Just one consideration: after the first stages of the affair, in which ED moderators closed all the posts in which it was enough to mention this matter, now they are intervening in a very soft way in a topic in which every possible and imaginable rule has been broken: there has been talk of other simulators, inferences have been made about the commercial and legal implications of the matter, there have been flames among users and so on. I think they're probing the mood of the community, so they can predict how we'll react when the end of this story (whatever it is, but I fear not a good one) will be told.

 

Could be. But maybe the reason for not closing this thread is just to leave us at least one thread to discuss this topic because closing every single thread about this might heat up the situation even more than it already is. But i think it might be better to be a bit more careful with all the speculations about who might do what with which (legal) consequences because it reaches from „all fine soon“ to „this is the end of DCS and our little world“. I think (almost) no one writing comments here really knows what‘s actually going on. There a just a few official statements from RB and ED more than one month ago - not nearly enough for any assumptions.

Just my opinion.

[eFirehawk]

11 hours ago, nessuno0505 said:

Just one consideration: after the first stages of the affair, in which ED moderators closed all the posts in which it was enough to mention this matter, now they are intervening in a very soft way in a topic in which every possible and imaginable rule has been broken: there has been talk of other simulators, inferences have been made about the commercial and legal implications of the matter, there have been flames among users and so on. I think they're probing the mood of the community, so they can predict how we'll react when the end of this story (whatever it is, but I fear not a good one) will be told.

 

Is anyone else scared that this is exactly it? I wonder if it even makes financial sense for ED to solve this, given that apparently (no one can claim that for sure of course, this is just my imagination of course :) ED makes the bulk of DCS's revenue from selling modules, not maintaining them (aka the fantastic pyramid-scheme), and since most of the people who would have bought the F-15E did so already (as it's been for sale for close to a year), if ED can just keep the dev's share of a module that already sold what it had to sell and see no 'significant' future with them anymore regardless of being in good terms with them again, it would obviously make a lot of sense numbers-wise  - so gauging if the community will just 'cool down' about it and leave it behind while still buying new modules would be reasonable.

Of course I'm probably wrong, however not paying the devs for months (claim which was not yet denied) for a product that is still in the shop selling for close to a year is incredibly strange, so it leaves some room for imagination.

Edited May 11, 2024 by eFirehawk
typo

[Guille H. Mono]

2 hours ago, eFirehawk said:

Is anyone else scared that this is exactly it? I wonder if it even makes financial sense for ED to solve this, given that apparently (no one can claim that for sure of course, this is just my imagination of course :) ED makes the bulk of DCS's revenue from selling modules, not maintaining them (aka the fantastic pyramid-scheme), and since most of the people who would have bought the F-15E did so already (as it's been for sale for close to a year), if ED can just keep the dev's share of a module that already sold what it had to sell and see no 'significant' future with them anymore regardless of being in good terms with them again, it would obviously make a lot of sense numbers-wise  - so gauging if the community will just 'cool down' about it and leave it behind while still buying new modules would be reasonable.

Of course I'm probably wrong, however not paying the devs for months (claim which was not yet denied) for a product that is still in the shop selling for close to a year is incredibly strange, so it leaves some room for imagination.

 

Don't let your imagination torture you this way. Don't try with others.

[Silver_Dragon]

2 hours ago, eFirehawk said:

ED makes the bulk of DCS's revenue from selling modules, not maintaining them (aka the fantastic pyramid-scheme)

[AndyJWest]

I suspect that ED probably makes most of its money from repeat customers. Which it is in their best business interest to ensure that it retains them.

[maxTRX]

1 hour ago, Silver_Dragon said:

I have one ready for this weekend's sun flare...  It's gonna be big

[Slippa]

51 minutes ago, oldcrusty said:

I have one ready for this weekend's sun flare...  It's gonna be big

Let’s be careful out there.

[nessuno0505]

If tomorrow Zambrano were to say, "We have resolved the dispute, the development of our modules will resume", would you buy the F-15 if you were interested in doing so but stopped because of the recent dispute? And what about another future product by Razbam?

Did you buy the f-4 and the kola map?

[unknown]

53 minutes ago, nessuno0505 said:

If tomorrow Zambrano were to say, "We have resolved the dispute, the development of our modules will resume", would you buy the F-15 if you were interested in doing so but stopped because of the recent dispute? And what about another future product by Razbam?

No and no.

 

53 minutes ago, nessuno0505 said:

Did you buy the f-4 and the kola map?

Yes and yes.

[Flia]

I already have kola map and i cannot wait to 21st to F-4 release. I belive ED and Heatblur.

Edited May 12, 2024 by Flia

[Gizmo03]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb nessuno0505:

If tomorrow Zambrano were to say, "We have resolved the dispute, the development of our modules will resume", would you buy the F-15 if you were interested in doing so but stopped because of the recent dispute? And what about another future product by Razbam?

Maybe a bit naiv but to be honest yes and yes.

 

vor 6 Stunden schrieb nessuno0505:

Did you buy the f-4 and the kola map?

Yes and not yet (due to lack of disk space).

[Ignition]

6 hours ago, nessuno0505 said:

If tomorrow Zambrano were to say, "We have resolved the dispute, the development of our modules will resume", would you buy the F-15 if you were interested in doing so but stopped because of the recent dispute? And what about another future product by Razbam?

Did you buy the f-4 and the kola map?

I've bought the F-15E on release but I would buy it, other product depends on what aircraft but I doubt they will continue developing new things for ED.

I didn't bought the F-4, kola, Afghanistan and neither the CH-47. I will not buy anything more until the F-15E resumes the development or I have my money back.

[Rhinozherous]

I fear IF they continue developing the F15E it will be a half a**ed thing. And I dont think they make something new after this. 

[Ignition]

3 hours ago, Rhinozherous said:

I fear IF they continue developing the F15E it will be a half a**ed thing. And I dont think they make something new after this. 

I fear the same, the F-15E will not be the same F-15E it was meant to be.

[diego999]

16 hours ago, nessuno0505 said:

If tomorrow Zambrano were to say, "We have resolved the dispute, the development of our modules will resume", would you buy the F-15 if you were interested in doing so but stopped because of the recent dispute? And what about another future product by Razbam?

I don't have a strong interest in the F-15 but always thought I was going to get it eventually. Not after all this.

I have the Harrier and the MiG-19, but I bought the latter knowing it was a half-dead module. That's on me.  

  

16 hours ago, nessuno0505 said:

Did you buy the f-4 and the kola map?

 

Yes on the Phantom. It's the plane I always wanted, plus I have the Tomcat, I love it, and expect the F-4 to be the same or better.

No on Kola.

[primus_TR]

22 hours ago, nessuno0505 said:

If tomorrow Zambrano were to say, "We have resolved the dispute, the development of our modules will resume", would you buy the F-15 if you were interested in doing so but stopped because of the recent dispute? And what about another future product by Razbam?

Did you buy the f-4 and the kola map?

I wouldn't touch anything from RAZBAM with a ten-foot stick. I had purchased Mig19 (as I am a sucker for red birds), but that's it. Never again.

F4 was a day-one pre-purchase for me. Looking forward to getting my hands on it. 

Kola is not an interesting theater to me, so no. 

Will most likely get Afghan map and CH47, after I have some free cash.

Edited May 13, 2024 by primus_TR

[Eugel]

23 hours ago, nessuno0505 said:

If tomorrow Zambrano were to say, "We have resolved the dispute, the development of our modules will resume", would you buy the F-15 if you were interested in doing so but stopped because of the recent dispute? And what about another future product by Razbam?

Did you buy the f-4 and the kola map?

From me, that´s a no to all of the question.

I don´t think I´d buy another Razbam module regardless of how they resolve their problems.
And while I was always very cautious with early access, this whole thing made me even more cautious. 

[Swiso]

Right now both parts state that they are talking and working on solving the issues. 

We, as a customers, we find ourself like in a limbo situation...work on RB modules is stopped...could be temporarily or for good...

I hope that all things will be sorted out, but if not the case, could we at least expect from ED an announcement saying clearly that from "today" RB would no longer be Licensed Third Party member and what they intend to do moving with RB modules going forward? 

Thus not live in this limbo forever...

Thanks.

Edited May 13, 2024 by Swiso

[MAXsenna]

This thread's been going on for a month... Patience is a virtue! Stay strong guys!

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk