waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[Gorn_GER]

3 hours ago, Beirut said:

 

For my part, I have not bought everything in the store. But of course I do have all the maps. 

 

That said, my response was not one sided. My response was based on the quality of the map, the quality of support for the map, and the enjoyable flights that can be had with it. If a particular module or campaign is lacking in thing A or thing B, that does not take away from the map being very interesting and sometimes downright stunning. It is, after all, a very large chunk of South America. And I love it. 

 

Like with all things in this sim, it's what you make of it.

you right but the fact that the question was not directly about the quality of the map but if people should buy it or not. My answer showed another point of view that it does not matter if the quality is good or bad, it more depends on what you do with it when you got it. If you have no clue what to do with the map because you are no missionmaker by yourself and did not find any Campaigns in the Store or Missions in the Userdata, you may never find a reason to play on that map. And this point of view was not represented in all the answers, before. Therefor i gave this special pepper to the soup.

Even though the SA map was introduced with 2.7.15, there is not a single buyable Campaign in the store. With Caucasus, PG and Syria, you got plenty of campaigns to play in singleplayer. And in never saw a Public server with SA map represented. Just a single Video Campaign by GrimReapers with their fictional Titan Campaign, that was abandon after 1 or 2 Missions.

17 hours ago, freehand said:

So is the SA a keeper as I am tempted a purchase ?

 

In the same way, I have no reason to buy Sinai, too. ED and the 3rd party developer should try to focus more on giving playable contextual content for terrains and modules, before they release them. When the Mig-29G comes to DCS, we need a EAST/WEST Germany conflict scenario for it or something similar to find a use for that module. If it comes with nothing but early acces functions, many players will buy it and try to have fun anyway but for a module that you can use on any other Map and Server, it is more easy to find a reason to fly it than on maps that have no missions.

 

ED Dynamic Campains that work on every map could change that. When they finished the work, all modules will globaly get more value in any aspect as long as all Modules, terrains and Tech-Packs are represented with that DC Mode.

Edited December 8, 2024 by Gorn_GER
more context

[Beirut]

3 hours ago, Gorn_GER said:

you right but the fact that the question was not directly about the quality of the map but if people should buy it or not. My answer showed another point of view that it does not matter if the quality is good or bad, it more depends on what you do with it when you got it. If you have no clue what to do with the map because you are no missionmaker by yourself and did not find any Campaigns in the Store or Missions in the Userdata, you may never find a reason to play on that map. And this point of view was not represented in all the answers, before. Therefor i gave this special pepper to the soup.

Even though the SA map was introduced with 2.7.15, there is not a single buyable Campaign in the store. With Caucasus, PG and Syria, you got plenty of campaigns to play in singleplayer. And in never saw a Public server with SA map represented. Just a single Video Campaign by GrimReapers with their fictional Titan Campaign, that was abandon after 1 or 2 Missions.

 

I make my own missions and I often just fly the SA map for the pleasure of flying.  DCS is a giant sandbox. It's up to each person to figure out how they can enjoy it.

 

As I've said before: I'm a flightsimmer, give me a paper airplane and a map of Bismarck's outhouse, I'll find a way to have fun with it.

[Rudel_chw]

29 minutes ago, Beirut said:

I make my own missions and I often just fly the SA map for the pleasure of flying. 

 

+1 ... learning the free Mission Editor is actually much more worthwhile that just purchasing a Map, for me it is actually a "game within a game"  

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

42 minutes ago, Rudel_chw said:

 

+1 ... learning the free Mission Editor is actually much more worthwhile that just purchasing a Map, for me it is actually a "game within a game"  

This is how you lose hours upon hours of time.

[afnav130]

2 hours ago, rob10 said:

The short answer is NO ONE KNOWS yet if the F-15E is dead or not.  Both sides appear to be working on keeping it alive, but until a final agreement is made, or they stop trying to get an agreement, it is completely impossible to give you the answer you want because there currently is no YES or NO.

ED can't do anything with the HAWK because they don't have the source code.  The only way they could do anything with it is to literally start from zero and create the whole thing themselves.  Completely different to what they did for the F-5E.

The story I have been hearing is that both sides have lawyers looking at the evidence. Requests are being made from a party who appears to be dragging their feet. It would also seem that month (s) go by without any communication on requests.

I will not say who is doing that, but I trust the source that it is true. It takes both sides to want a good faith resolution. 

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

3 hours ago, afnav130 said:

The story I have been hearing is that both sides have lawyers looking at the evidence. Requests are being made from a party who appears to be dragging their feet. It would also seem that month (s) go by without any communication on requests.

I will not say who is doing that, but I trust the source that it is true. It takes both sides to want a good faith resolution. 

From our perspective, it does look like feet are dragging. But, in a legal sense? It might not be.

Involving lawyers is like having an anchor tied to your neck and then being asked to outrun public interest who is being represented by Usain Bolt.

[Mizzy]

5 hours ago, Rudel_chw said:

 

 for me it is actually a "game within a game"  

This is true for many I believe. DCS is a fountain of joy for many of us as a platform who love military aviation. It is true DCS has no competition but then again that is why we have DCS ! I remember a message from Igor Tishin just after 'Lock On' was published and he said there was a market for a high fidelity commercial military based flight simulator and he was right RIP Igor.

Mizzy

[Oban]

4 hours ago, afnav130 said:

The story I have been hearing is that both sides have lawyers looking at the evidence. Requests are being made from a party who appears to be dragging their feet. It would also seem that month (s) go by without any communication on requests.

I will not say who is doing that, but I trust the source that it is true. It takes both sides to want a good faith resolution. 

That's in contrast to what another RB dev stated though, when he claimed ED were allegedly supposed to be payong RB at the end of November, but they didn't, so there has to have been dialogue involved for that alleged specific date to be mentioned.

[Pipe]

56 minutes ago, Oban said:

That's in contrast to what another RB dev stated though, when he claimed ED were allegedly supposed to be payong RB at the end of November, but they didn't, so there has to have been dialogue involved for that alleged specific date to be mentioned.

Cmon ED and RB give us a great Xmas!

[Mike Force Team]

@Pipe

I believe the polar ice caps are more likely to melt before we get an official update on this ongoing dispute. 

[Pipe]

28 minutes ago, Mike Force Team said:

@Pipe

I believe the polar ice caps are more likely to melt before we get an official update on this ongoing dispute. 

Sad but true..the stuff dreams are made of

[StarLiner]

We're going to get an update before Christmas.

 

I have no source or proof because I made it up. I'm optimistic to the point of recklessness. The strike eagle will gets its next update in January then the Flogger will come out and Nineline will personally code the fix for spotting into the game and everyone will clap it will be great just believe okay

[Horns]

7 hours ago, afnav130 said:

The story I have been hearing is that both sides have lawyers looking at the evidence. Requests are being made from a party who appears to be dragging their feet. It would also seem that month (s) go by without any communication on requests.

I will not say who is doing that, but I trust the source that it is true. It takes both sides to want a good faith resolution. 

The only sources worth quoting are either a joint statement from both parties or a judgment from an arbitrator. If it’s a source from either side talking about the other it’s in their interests to make the other side look bad.

[Eaglewings]

The only sources worth quoting are either a joint statement from both parties or a judgment from an arbitrator. If it’s a source from either side talking about the other it’s in their interests to make the other side look bad.

This pretty much explain the whole situation.

Sent from my XQ-AT52 using Tapatalk

[BIGNEWY]

Thread cleaned. 

A reminder, please do not use profanity on the forum and treat everyone with respect. 

 

Folks don't let the toxicity of the internet get you down, we know it is difficult and emotions are high, remember we are all here because we love military aviation, have fun, enjoy your flights. As soon as we have news to share we will share it about the dispute. 

thank you 

[Horns]

I guess we've had our last major update for 2024, and so far we haven't seen any updates break any of the Razbam modules.

I know people expected much more from the mudhen this year and rightly so, but at least things haven't gone backwards since Razbam suspended support.

Here's hoping the Razbam modules stay compatible with all updates in 2025 and until the resolution of the dispute.

[LordOrion]

On 12/9/2024 at 4:28 AM, StarLiner said:

We're going to get an update before Christmas.

 

I have no source or proof because I made it up. I'm optimistic to the point of recklessness. The strike eagle will gets its next update in January then the Flogger will come out and Nineline will personally code the fix for spotting into the game and everyone will clap it will be great just believe okay

I stopped believing in Santa Claus many, many years ago...

[MAXsenna]

I stopped believing in Santa Claus many, many years ago...

That's sad....

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk

[Lyrode]

2024/12/8 PM1点43分，_UnknownCheater_说：

All players should refrain from purchasing anything until this is resolved

Not only would it not help the ongoing dispute, it also harms the interest of other devs.

What did hb, dis, m3 and all other 3d party, campaign makers do wrong?

[Ignition]

1 hour ago, Lyrode said:

Not only would it not help the ongoing dispute, it also harms the interest of other devs.

What did hb, dis, m3 and all other 3d party, campaign makers do wrong?

How do we know this won't happen again with other 3rd party?, it already happened with VEAO and now with RAZBAM. It may be a cyclic warning from ED to other 3rd parties to produce force with their military product.

[Horns]

2 hours ago, Ignition said:

How do we know this won't happen again with other 3rd party?, it already happened with VEAO and now with RAZBAM. It may be a cyclic warning from ED to other 3rd parties to produce force with their military product.

I think this is where people mention none of us know if we’ll live to see tomorrow - one can make a lot of bad decisions based on not knowing what might happen. Also, please note no third party has so much as made a public statement of sympathy for Razbam, let alone asking people to boycott any modules or products.

If you worry about the future of our third parties, I suspect buying their products is a better way of showing support. YMMV.

[erniedaoage]

9 hours ago, Ignition said:

How do we know this won't happen again with other 3rd party?, it already happened with VEAO and now with RAZBAM. It may be a cyclic warning from ED to other 3rd parties to produce force with their military product.

We will know after the dispute ist settled. It doesn't even matter how it turns out, all that matters is what's going on after everything is resolved. Surely ED and RB will (hopefully) have an emergency plan and we don't run into another veao fiasco. 

You can get your pitchfork out as soon as everything turns out the same way as with veao. 

But you can also stay at home, till the end of your life, because there is always a possibility that a malfunctioning airplane is trying to land on top of you. It's your choice.

[Oban]

Why do people keep bringing up the VEAO hawk issue, and comparing it to this current one?  it's comparing apples to oranges, very different circumstances, and only 1 presently met its demise.

[Rudel_chw]

9 minutes ago, Oban said:

Why do people keep bringing up the VEAO hawk issue, and comparing it to this current one? 

 

Probably because its the only precedent of a third party breaking up with ED?

 

9 minutes ago, Oban said:

it's comparing apples to oranges, very different circumstances

 

For me, the only difference is that with the VEAO "issue" I lost one DCS Module, it's still on my account but I can't fly it anymore, while with the Razbam issue I'm risking 4 modules to be in the same situation (not sure about the SA map, as its real developer seems to still be maintaining it).

[Oban]

Breaking up with ED? I don't believe it was that simple, as far as Im aware, the developers were not meeting certain standards laid down by ED, and underperformaing, and when you don't meet your contracted employers standards in ANY industry, you're released from contract, or fired, so why should ED be any different?

Razbam are nothing like VEAO, the circumstances are vastly different, not one person here knows what the outcome could be, it's nothing but speculation, we all know what the outcome should be.

Yes, for sure there's a potential for having all RB products cease to work over a period of time, this is common in software, but it's not going to happen overnight. The glass half empty guys are full of doom and gloom, the glass half full guys are more optimistic, I'd much rather be the glass half full, and be optimistic... and at the end of the day, this may sound bad, but I'd much rather lose support of my RB products over time, than lose the entire platform, with dozens more modules..

I don't believe in cutting off ones nose to spite their face works, because you tend to miss out on a lot of fun that others are enjoying... and I'd much rather have fun, life's too short..

Seasons Greetings to you and your family Rudel, Feliz Navidad !!