waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[SkateZilla]

On 5/23/2024 at 12:37 AM, Annelid said:

We need to create a DATABASE.  Which version of DCS is the best version for playing certain older modules that may or not be supported in the future.  So we can roll back DCS to play those modules.

https://forum.dcs.world/topic/94816-guide-info-dcs-updater-usage-version-numbers-module-ids/?do=findComment&comment=2621546

[Silver_Dragon]

On 5/23/2024 at 5:37 AM, Annelid said:

We need to create a DATABASE.  Which version of DCS is the best version for playing certain older modules that may or not be supported in the future.  So we can roll back DCS to play those modules.

You have a Database (Maintain by Skatezilla), and intent a rollback to that very old DCS World version will be very problematic (you lost all of new modules from the last compatible "Hawk" working version), and not sure if actual version of DCS has capable to go some years on the past without breaking them, with a version with has not capable to work with actual multiplayer servers.

[DN308]

Good point leading me to close my wallet for a while regarding DCS.

Many thanks for the advice and for my currency’s balance

[Annelid]

4 hours ago, Silver_Dragon said:

You have a Database (Maintain by Skatezilla), and intent a rollback to that very old DCS World version will be very problematic (you lost all of new modules from the last compatible "Hawk" working version), and not sure if actual version of DCS has capable to go some years on the past without breaking them, with a version with has not capable to work with actual multiplayer servers.

Might be no choice.  Roll back to play older modules and update to current to play new.  Go back and forth.

[Czar66]

16 hours ago, Ignition said:

It's the best aircraft of DCS.

I agree, because I need to put on the brakes to avoid flying it because of the TPOD and other incorrect behaviors contribute to bad habits.
Example: Need to bump the pod for area track or point track to work after input of the proper hotas command. Jettisoning ordinance from the CFT renders radar missiles inoperable in certain loadout conditions.

It is the best multi role platform available in DCS design wise. I dislike using the word 'potential' because that's fantasy land.

7 hours ago, vctpil said:

A-10C II, F-14 and F-4 are the best aircraft because they are fully functionnal (I don't have all modules). I also considering the F/A-18. For the others...

You're missing out on the Hornet to the extent of likely needing to change that list after you get it. Save for the Warthog. That bird is irreplaceable.

Edited May 24, 2024 by Czar66

[Ignition]

8 hours ago, Hiob said:

it's a great aircraft, no question!

But absolute statements like this are of course illegitimate. Best for what? Best for whom? There are so many great Aircraft in DCS (including those from Razbam). Lots of them are very capable in many scenarios, others are more "one-trick-pony" but may be perfect for some users.

I don't know - statements like this (even if hyperbolic just for emphasis) irritate me. Be open to different experiences in different aircrafts....

LOL, it was an expression. Relax.

It has many great things, like multicrew, AA and AG radar, it can carry very good loadout like AGM-130 or GBU-39 (maybe in the future) and a lot of thrust and fuel to carry many weapons. I like the physics, the UFC with all the features (still missing features like TOT), the pages in the mfds, JTIDS, TEWS is great also.

What can I say, is the best aircraft of DCS.

[Hiob]

I like it, too! 

But I can’t go soo far. It would make my other aircraft jealous! 

[sniperpr1]

So, what is the word from the Razbam Devs?

[Nightdare]

On 5/22/2024 at 12:42 AM, Pipe said:

Not 100% sure but I dont think anyone would sign a contract that has a;

Oh BTW if you piss us off, we will not pay you clause

 

You need to ask yourself 2 things:

How is a company gonna ensure its subcontractors deliver on their promises?

And

How do you piss off your client?

 

[Mud]

For me flying is my passion and DCS with VR is by far the closest I would ever get to flying the real aircraft we can fly.
The F-15E is the first Razbam module I purchased, and I fell in love with it right away. Notso as SME and his videos and the radar chicken god obviously did a phenomenal job, and probably a lot more people who are involved.

We probably cannot do much as a community apart from letting both parties know that we admire their work, and hope they sort our their issues.  The speculating and spitting is not helping us or them.

Edited May 24, 2024 by Mud

[Ignition]

16 hours ago, Lace said:

Actually, that's exactly what you did pay for. 

You may have had the expectations of a fully working module, but we are all well versed with the 'early access' caveats.  If you want a finished product, wait until it is finished before spending your money.

Not how it should be perhaps, but this is the reality of software these days.

 

This businesses model doesn't work like that. If no one buys the EA then there will be no modules developed. Someone needs to pay beforehand so the development can continue.

2 hours ago, sniperpr1 said:

So, what is the word from the Razbam Devs?

Nothing, and ED said nothing also. To many preorders active and the release of the F4 so they will not say anything.

[VpR81]

13 hours ago, vctpil said:

A-10C II, F-14 and F-4 are the best aircraft because they are fully functionnal (I don't have all modules). I also considering the F/A-18. For the others...

They all had/have their bugs and issues during EA/until now, but in comparison the Strike Eagle provided one of the best packages at EA start. Sidewinders, Sparrows, Amraams, a fleshed out Radar and FM, Durandals, LGBs and a huge amount of various other A/G ordonance from day one. And multicrew was also usable. Sure it had sync issues and still has some in it´s currents state, but when i think about the Apache back then...well. Also JDAMs, TFR and JSOWs following pretty short after EA launch. I´d say, in terms of functionality and bang for the buck, the Strike Eagle was one of the best EA launches DCS has ever seen with the first confirmed kill of the mudhen beeing the ED download server. Razbam made a great job with the Strike Eagle until this ED/RB issue occured.

I´ve been waiting for this bird to come back onto PC since Jane´s F-15 and it may easily replace the Hornet as my fav. jet.... i hope so bad this issue gets solved and the Mudhen will get some love again.

[Pipe]

2 hours ago, Nightdare said:

 

You need to ask yourself 2 things:

How is a company gonna ensure its subcontractors deliver on their promises?

And

How do you piss off your client?

 

1) I guess ED decided to use the “North Korea” model. Keep the people who depend on you starving. 
2) That’s easy, tell them what they just bought is no longer supported and they’re SOL

[mazex]

2 hours ago, Mud said:

For me flying is my passion and DCS with VR is by far the closest I would ever get to flying the real aircraft we can fly.
The F-15E is the first Razbam module I purchased, and I fell in love with it right away. Notso as SME and his videos and the radar chicken god obviously did a phenomenal job, and probably a lot more people who are involved.

We probably cannot do much as a community apart from letting both parties know that we admire their work, and hope they sort our their issues.  The speculating and spitting is not helping us or them.

 

Agreed - I have been supporting ED for decades and have more modules than I can count. Do not know how many hundred dollars I have sent their way. And right now I am not buying any until this is sorted out. I just realized that this embarrassing debacle made me stop playing any flight sims. Just updating now to try the F4 and the Kola map that I bought before I made the decision to pause DCS. 

Download not done and checked that I have 25 modules. A bunch on sale etc so lets say USD 50 each. Thats USD 1250... And then all maps, super carriers and other stuff.  And Flanker 2.0, Lomac as well. Thats probably close to 2000 dollars... Thats actually money

OK - just had one of my best flight sim experiences in the F4 that really feels like a vibrating piece of heavy metal with two big engines... And realizing that they have a big bunch of missions for all maps accept the WW2 ones in the day 1 release. And those vortices along the slats... Top that off with those button configuration lists  So I guess I have to get back to flying DCS now, but not buying.

Edited May 24, 2024 by mazex

[NineLine]

21 minutes ago, Pipe said:

1) I guess ED decided to use the “North Korea” model. Keep the people who depend on you starving. 
2) That’s easy, tell them what they just bought is no longer supported and they’re SOL

Again, I know things are frustrating right now, but let's not get carried away. As we have said, the goal is to get back to normal development as soon as possible. 

[Nightdare]

38 minutes ago, Pipe said:

1) I guess ED decided to use the “North Korea” model. Keep the people who depend on you starving. 

"If you do the work we signed you up for, you will get paid"

...Yeah, I'm sure that's only in North Korea

Don't know about you, but if I sit on my ass for a month, when I ask my boss for my money after that time, the only thing I get is my dismissal

 

It seems you don't want ED to make sure you receive the module you paid for in advance

Well, in that case, I've got 500 new modules to offer to ED, and I'm sure you'll pre-pay all of them and then complain that ED shafted you when I've disappeared into thin air counting my money from the pre-orders

 

38 minutes ago, Pipe said:

2) That’s easy, tell them what they just bought is no longer supported and they’re SOL

 

How about you go tell your boss that you won't be doing what's in your contract anymore

 

 

I think is funny with all these comments "Until this is resolved, I won't be signing up for any preorders"

But when ED doesn't want to shell out cash to RB 'until this (whatever it is) issue is resolved" they're supposed to keep giving them money?

 

[Hammer1-1]

1 hour ago, Nightdare said:

"If you do the work we signed you up for, you will get paid"

...Yeah, I'm sure that's only in North Korea

Don't know about you, but if I sit on my ass for a month, when I ask my boss for my money after that time, the only thing I get is my dismissal

 

It seems you don't want ED to make sure you receive the module you paid for in advance

Well, in that case, I've got 500 new modules to offer to ED, and I'm sure you'll pre-pay all of them and then complain that ED shafted you when I've disappeared into thin air counting my money from the pre-orders

 

 

How about you go tell your boss that you won't be doing what's in your contract anymore

 

 

I think is funny with all these comments "Until this is resolved, I won't be signing up for any preorders"

But when ED doesn't want to shell out cash to RB 'until this (whatever it is) issue is resolved" they're supposed to keep giving them money?

 

Given how long Ive been flying sims, when these aircraft were announced the first thing that went through my mind was...anyone but Razbam. Suffice to say, I was pleasantly surprised right up to the moment I can say I wasnt surprised at all, and yes I can actually believe that because 15+ years playing flight sims have told me who were good at their jobs and who...wasnt...and didnt...really care.  The fact Razbam did this didnt surprise me and a lot of other people from the old FSX/P3D days in the know at all.

[Cab]

Alot of this thread brings to mind when people assumed we'd all be more informed with wide-spread access to online information.

Oh well.

[Pipe]

1 hour ago, Nightdare said:

"If you do the work we signed you up for, you will get paid"

...Yeah, I'm sure that's only in North Korea

Don't know about you, but if I sit on my ass for a month, when I ask my boss for my money after that time, the only thing I get is my dismissal

 

It seems you don't want ED to make sure you receive the module you paid for in advance

Well, in that case, I've got 500 new modules to offer to ED, and I'm sure you'll pre-pay all of them and then complain that ED shafted you when I've disappeared into thin air counting my money from the pre-orders

 

 

How about you go tell your boss that you won't be doing what's in your contract anymore

 

 

I think is funny with all these comments "Until this is resolved, I won't be signing up for any preorders"

But when ED doesn't want to shell out cash to RB 'until this (whatever it is) issue is resolved" they're supposed to keep giving them money?

 

They delivered a module as good as any in dcs if not better, what did they get? Nothing

Sat around for a month? They worked many months without pay, I’m sure by your posts that you would be agreeable to this?

Must be nice to live in your moms basement and not worry about eating or bills to pay

[Hammer1-1]

20 minutes ago, Pipe said:

They delivered a module as good as any in dcs if not better, what did they get? Nothing

Sat around for a month? They worked many months without pay, I’m sure by your posts that you would be agreeable to this?

Must be nice to live in your moms basement and not worry about eating or bills to pay

How do you know they got nothing? Im willing to bet you know little to none of the issues at play...and the module is far from good.

[scommander2]

I guess that it will be good that ED can post/update the status about RB at the ED web page so that all consumers, like myself, can follow-up what ED has any progress.

Just review "End-User License Agreement", all purchased products are not refundable and it is the agreement that I accepted for taking my own risk if the product may not be supported in one of days. 

The only hope is that ED is able to resolve the issue.  If not, it is the way is...

[Nightdare]

42 minutes ago, Pipe said:

Must be nice to live in your moms basement and not worry about eating or bills to pay

 

Actually I do live in her house, but that's because I had to switch off her life-support 16 years ago

and the reason that unlike you, I'm not worried about eating or bills to pay, is because I do my job in a way that my boss doesn't see a need or has a reason to withhold payment or end our contractual collaboration

 

Now, how about we don't exchange these kind of pleasantries anymore until you finally reached some level of maturity?

Edited May 25, 2024 by Nightdare

[Pipe]

16 minutes ago, Hammer1-1 said:

How do you know they got nothing? Im willing to bet you know little to none of the issues at play...and the module is far from good.

Razbam said they didn’t get paid, ED did not deny this. That’s what I do know…

You dont like the SE, that’s fair

3 minutes ago, Nightdare said:

 

Actually I do live in her house, but that's because I had to switch off her life-support 16 years ago

and the reason that unlike you, I'm not worried about eating or bills to pay, is because I do my job in a way that my boss doesn't see a need or has a reason to withhold payment or end our contractual collaboration

 

Now, how about we don't exchange these kind of pleasantries anymore until you finally reached some level of maturity?

 

Lol sure thing, it’s hard for me to get down to your level anyway

[Hammer1-1]

49 minutes ago, Pipe said:

Razbam said they didn’t get paid, ED did not deny this. That’s what I do know…

You dont like the SE, that’s fair

 

Razbam says a lot of things. What did they NOT say? How many modules that Razbam has out that are in an unfinished state? Ive been waiting on revamped manual and training mission for the Harrier for years...stuff that worked when I bought it, but was upgraded for whatever reason only God knows. Ive watched them start their own public relations bonfire after another over the last 15+ years, the latest of which I can recall would involve a certain individual that makes guides for every aircraft in DCS he possibly can.  Look: you can choose who you want to believe in this issue, but I promise you that you arent seeing the bigger issue here. Do I see the bigger picture? No...but I know my history, and from that I can extrapolate. Is it correct? My betting odds are 50/50, but bearing an official statement its just a guess.

 

Ive worked on the MQ25 program for about 2 years and recently left Boeing because of all the issues I see on that line. The NAVY sees issues as well..and I know that if Boeing doesnt deliver, that contract is in jeopardy. Same thing goes with 3rd part modules. I assure you its something you're missing. And just FYI, I love the Mud Hen...its not good because its not even close to being finished. I stand behind my statement when I said I wish it were someone else making it.

Edited May 25, 2024 by Hammer1-1

[Pipe]

11 minutes ago, Hammer1-1 said:

Razbam says a lot of things. What did they NOT say? How many modules that Razbam has out that are in an unfinished state? Ive been waiting on revamped manual and training mission for years...stuff that worked when I bought it, but was upgraded for whatever reason only God knows. Ive watched them start their own public relations bonfire after another over the last 15+ years, the latest of which I can recall would involve a certain individual that makes guides for every aircraft in DCS he possibly can.  Look: you can choose who you want to believe in this issue, but I promise you that you arent seeing the bigger issue here. Do I see the bigger picture? No...but I know my history, and from that I can extrapolate. Is it correct? My betting odds are 50/50, but bearing an official statement its just a guess.

 

Ive worked on the MQ25 program for about 2 years and recently left Boeing because of all the issues I see on that line. The NAVY sees issues as well..and I know that if Boeing doesnt deliver, that contract is in jeopardy. Same thing goes with 3rd part modules. I assure you its something you're missing.

 

I’m not a fanboi either way, Razbam has unfinished modules no doubt. I think it’s fair to say very few modules in DCS are complete. 
I have no knowledge about what is going on in other sims, don’t use them. 
I am pissed that they have not been paid, somewhat for selfish reasons, I have many RB planes. But also seems the little guy is being bullied. 
If Razbam is in the wrong contractually, why wouldn’t ED just go through legal channels? Let’s face it, would be better for everyone if RB was still working on there planes. And the paying public was none the wiser. 
 

Boeing seems to have many issues..