Oculus Rift and DCS World Discussion

[javelina1]

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=93477&highlight=oculus+rift

[Tone71]

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=93477&highlight=Occulus

 

Try reading through this first...

 

Edit: Whoa, way too slow! :)

Edited March 2, 2014 by Tone71
Sniped, twice!

[HydroBIG BANG]

My personal view and I do not speak for Eagle on this:

 

I think this is very interesting, but until I see a means for easily viewing the keyboard hands-free, I am not sure how well this would work with a DCS title that often requires heavy keyboard use.

It wouldn't be much of a problem for people who have a HOTAS Warthog setup due to the fact that all the combat functions will be bound to the HOTAS stuff.

For me personally the downside of not being able to see the keyboard would be greatly be outweighed by the epic experience of having virtual reality.

[Zomba]

Maybe one thing that could be cheaply done is put a cheap camera on the front of the headset with a paddle switch on the side or something so that you can quickly whack the paddle and switch to a feed from the cam so that you can use that to look at the keyboard or whatever. Saves having to pull the headset up so that you can peek out.

[wasyl00]

It wouldn't be much of a problem for people who have a HOTAS Warthog setup due to the fact that all the combat functions will be bound to the HOTAS stuff.

For me personally the downside of not being able to see the keyboard would be greatly be outweighed by the epic experience of having virtual reality.

 

 

This actually may come as a another benefit. Not being able to see the keyboard will convince people to use TS on multiplayer servers - which is better for overall immersion I suppose, instead type-spamming chat window:)

[Mohamengina]

 

Occulus being used inside DCS.

[Cyb0rg]

This actually may come as a another benefit. Not being able to see the keyboard will convince people to use TS on multiplayer servers - which is better for overall immersion I suppose, instead type-spamming chat window:)

 

On the other hand, a keyboard might be handy sometimes.

 

 

BTW, wish we had better ATC in DCS.

[maddabboyahoo.com]

 

Occulus being used inside DCS.

 

awesome!

[blksolo]

I think that is just some guy using Vorpx software for the Rift,native support will be much better and ED is working on that now.

[doveman]

Maybe one thing that could be cheaply done is put a cheap camera on the front of the headset with a paddle switch on the side or something so that you can quickly whack the paddle and switch to a feed from the cam so that you can use that to look at the keyboard or whatever. Saves having to pull the headset up so that you can peek out.

 

I still think the easiest and cheapest option is to just use VAC or some other voice control software, so that you don't need to use the mouse to click on switches.

 

Okay, that can't be used for turning knobs and is a bit longwinded for some buttons that you need to press repeatedly e.g. "Abris 3, Abris 3, Abris 3" or typing in numbers e.g. "PVI 1, PVI 5, PVI 7" but it works well for most stuff and a numpad would cover the PVI.

[npole]

I still think the easiest and cheapest option is to just use VAC or some other voice control software, so that you don't need to use the mouse to click on switches.

 

Okay, that can't be used for turning knobs and is a bit longwinded for some buttons that you need to press repeatedly e.g. "Abris 3, Abris 3, Abris 3" or typing in numbers e.g. "PVI 1, PVI 5, PVI 7" but it works well for most stuff and a numpad would cover the PVI.

 

Nope, the best option is to give up with semi-sim modules and stick with the full clickable cockpits. With a HOTAS and the A10-C, I do not use the keyboard at all, and when using the Rift, i can have the mouse crosshair linked to the view.. so I just point the relevant switch with my eyes and click it with 2 buttons on the hotas. But I also didn't found any trouble to use the mouse to do the same (you don't need to see the mouse to use it really).

[doveman]

Nope, the best option is to give up with semi-sim modules and stick with the full clickable cockpits. With a HOTAS and the A10-C, I do not use the keyboard at all, and when using the Rift, i can have the mouse crosshair linked to the view.. so I just point the relevant switch with my eyes and click it with 2 buttons on the hotas. But I also didn't found any trouble to use the mouse to do the same (you don't need to see the mouse to use it really).

 

It seems strange that anyone would be using a mouse with the Rift if the Rift can be used instead to easily put the cursor over a switch.

 

You just need to watch this bloke fumbling around for his mouse at 1:17 to see that it's not particularly convenient

A fixed position trackball would be a much better option if you wanted to go down that route. I've actually got a nice logitech trackball but haven't used it in a while as the LMB had an intermittent fault and I needed a mouse to play other games like ArmA3 anyway but if I can fix it up, I'd probably use that with DCS and the Rift until something better comes along. That SoftKinetic certainly sounds promising.

[maddabboyahoo.com]

Nope, the best option is to give up with semi-sim modules and stick with the full clickable cockpits. With a HOTAS and the A10-C, I do not use the keyboard at all, and when using the Rift, i can have the mouse crosshair linked to the view.. so I just point the relevant switch with my eyes and click it with 2 buttons on the hotas. But I also didn't found any trouble to use the mouse to do the same (you don't need to see the mouse to use it really).

 

agreed

 

also the dk1 has a small area under the nose that can been seen through if need be

 

the consumer rift likely will have cameras

if it does you can map a button to allow camera overlay over the scene

 

I have no trouble typing blind while using the rift

I use the mouse as described above

I look at what I want to click and use a joystick button to click the mouse

 

I only fly the p-51 so data entry is not an issue

 

a handy add on is my usb numpad which i can place anywhere they are cheap and with creative mapping could be used for many things

 

Good HOTAS will go far with the rift

 

but a cockpit with matched switches would be ideal just don't think it's needed

 

I feel fully like im in my p-51 and i have a cheap stick with twist rudder and throttle on it

It has only 12 buttons to map

 

Nice HOTAS and RIFT will take you most of the way.

 

For choppers that setup in above videos would be ideal.

That tweaked would also be ideal for wwII

 

You will not see your fancy cockpit you spend years building

So just buying and placing toggle switches that dont look great will do it for you

[Bushmanni]

It seems strange that anyone would be using a mouse with the Rift if the Rift can be used instead to easily put the cursor over a switch.

 

I put a "reticle" on a cap and tried how easy it would be to aim it to keys on my keyboard and found it to be very easy and fast. With sub 30ms latency it shouldn't be much harder to aim at cockpit buttons with Rift. You would still need some way of moving the cursor around so you don't have to use the center of the screen even for the aft panel buttons (and twist your neck excessively) but it doesn't need to be anything precise as you would just need to get the cursor somewhere around the corner of the display where the switch is. I suppose anyone with more recent version of Rift can't comment on this just yet how realistic this would be with actual hardware?

 

Doing away with keyboard would require some kind of alternate interface using this method that could be used for radio and game menus, etc. and some aircraft non-HOTAS controls currently not clickable (like Ka-50 throttles).

[doveman]

Doing away with keyboard would require some kind of alternate interface using this method that could be used for radio and game menus, etc. and some aircraft non-HOTAS controls currently not clickable (like Ka-50 throttles).

 

I'd say voice control is the best alternate interface for the radio menus. Not sure what alternative to the mouse cursor is needed for game menus? For things like the camera/ map views and throttles, again voice control works well.

[doveman]

How does the Rift do 6DOF? I've built a DIY tracker using a GY-80 gyro/accelerometer/magnetometer and whilst the gyro works well for 3DOF (in conjunction with the magnetometer to correct drift), it seems the accelerometer is not really suited for X,Y,Z, so what is the Rift using for those?

[Mnemonic]

How does the Rift do 6DOF? I've built a DIY tracker using a GY-80 gyro/accelerometer/magnetometer and whilst the gyro works well for 3DOF (in conjunction with the magnetometer to correct drift), it seems the accelerometer is not really suited for X,Y,Z, so what is the Rift using for those?

 

Rift Dev Kit 1 - tracks only 3DOF rotations with inertial sensors (Accelerometer, Gyro, Magnetometer)

But latest prototype they were demoing on public: Crystal Cove - does optical 6DOF tracking, they put IR LEDs on the front of the helmet and track them with external IR camera, like TrackIR.

[bongodriver]

How does the Rift do 6DOF? I've built a DIY tracker using a GY-80 gyro/accelerometer/magnetometer and whilst the gyro works well for 3DOF (in conjunction with the magnetometer to correct drift), it seems the accelerometer is not really suited for X,Y,Z, so what is the Rift using for those?

 

in DK1 it's not using 6DOF, in crystal cove it is using infra red led's with a IR camera for the translational tracking.

[doveman]

Rift Dev Kit 1 - tracks only 3DOF rotations with inertial sensors (Accelerometer, Gyro, Magnetometer)

But latest prototype they were demoing on public: Crystal Cove - does optical 6DOF tracking, they put IR LEDs on the front of the helmet and track them with external IR camera, like TrackIR.

 

Ah OK, thanks. In my experience using a PS3 Eye with IR filter removed and wide-angle LEDs, it loses track of 1 or more at about 45 degrees left or right, so I imagine that would be even more of a problem with the Rift where you don't have to keep looking at the monitor in front of you, so will be inclined to turn your head much more.

 

Maybe the best way round this is to automatically disable the X,Y,Z axis tracking (so that it doesn't start flipping out) when the Yaw is >x. We generally only use the X,Y,Z when facing forward or slightly to the L/R to see the wallpanels anyway, so I think this would work OK.

[bongodriver]

 

As a general rule, the best way to make yourself clear to a foreigner is to speak slower, stressing the separation between words, because the high speed at which we use to speak in our mother languages is what causes most trouble to a foreigner.

 

Standard RT phraseology is the most important factor.

[npole]

How does the Rift do 6DOF? I've built a DIY tracker using a GY-80 gyro/accelerometer/magnetometer and whilst the gyro works well for 3DOF (in conjunction with the magnetometer to correct drift), it seems the accelerometer is not really suited for X,Y,Z, so what is the Rift using for those?

 

I use the hydra strapped to the rift for the positional tracking.

I really don't like the optical solution they seems to use with the Crystal Cover OR, it reminds me the very bad experience i'm having with the TrackIR5. I want to be free of looking at my back while leaning .. if I want, not to be forced to have the "visual" to a stupid camera.

I hope they will reconsider this idea.. or eventually I hope they will use the leds only to improve the 6DOF and to eventually zeroing a gyro .. and not as the only solution for the positional tracking.

[maddabboyahoo.com]

Rift Dev Kit 1 - tracks only 3DOF rotations with inertial sensors (Accelerometer, Gyro, Magnetometer)

But latest prototype they were demoing on public: Crystal Cove - does optical 6DOF tracking, they put IR LEDs on the front of the helmet and track them with external IR camera, like TrackIR.

 

 

Other rift demos using early rifts do the opposite. They placed cameras on the rift and put markers on the walls away from the user in the environment that the rift actively tracks outward. This allowed movement in a large 3d space.

 

Both methods work but require modification of the environment.

 

Other methods:

 

Kinnect tracks users head and body and arms

 

There will be many solutions for this that will have to be customized for each application to be ideal. There is no one size fits all solution to 6dof.

 

I do 6dof with opentrack and the sdk1. I printed a marker for the front of the rift.

 

It totally cures drift but isn't so good when you turn ur head and the marker can't be seen.

 

-michael

[ReviZorro]

I use the hydra strapped to the rift for the positional tracking.

...

npole

Can you explain the details of using razer hydra as a pointing device in DCS? Razer Game Comfigurations settings, DCS settings?

Thanks in advance.

[Mnemonic]

Other methods:

 

Kinnect tracks users head and body and arms

 

I did that some time ago, results are quite good but not "consumer grade" good, also it requires for quite a hectic setup. Here are some of my experiments I did back in 2011:

 

 

Edited March 6, 2014 by Mnemonic

[npole]

npole

Can you explain the details of using razer hydra as a pointing device in DCS? Razer Game Comfigurations settings, DCS settings?

Thanks in advance.

 

You can use a modified version of opentrack, it will use the gyro in the Oculus Rift for the head tracking, plus the razer hydra (one of the controllers) for the positional tracking: you need to "strap" it on your oculus rift.

 

To have a cross-hair in the middle of your screen and use it as "mouse pointer" (to use the cockpit switches...) you need to modify your clickable_common .lua: use_click_and_pan_mode = true