DCS now supports OpenXR natively

[Burt]

Same here but I think we have to manually update now. And maybe make a desktop short for DCS.updater

Edited January 31, 2023 by Burt

[t1mb0b]

1 hour ago, Wali763 said:

I also had my link in the startmenu to DCSupdater.exe. I changed the link to DCS.exe and added --force_enable_VR  --force_OpenXR. Then it worked.

All very well and good, however not a jibe at yourself.

A lot of us have invested time into DCS Updater and its ability to handle the many supporting components, like PiTool, SRS, VoiceAttack to name 3.

Simply going back to launching DCS.exe with switches leaves those users a bit high and dry.

Does anyone know where DCSUpdater stores the command lines for 'VR' and 'non VR', sorry for slight thread drift.

 

Edited January 31, 2023 by t1mb0b

[Tshark]

5 hours ago, mbucchia said:

Released a new version of OpenXR Toolkit 1.2.4, when used with DCS in native OpenXR mode, will let you use WMR reprojection and also Turbo Mode.

Quickstart | OpenXR Toolkit (mbucchia.github.io)

Thank you so much for your efforts!!!!  Does the new version include the new re-projection that has been in testing?

 

[rosteven1]

22 hours ago, RealDCSpilot said:

No crashes here with Pico4, VD and OpenXR over SteamVR. Can play for hours and it's running great. Native OpenXR is a great feature for DCS.

I'm confused, what would be the benefit of running OpenXR over SteamVR.  It was my understanding that you ran OpenXR because it 1) required less overhead than Steam (giving higher FPS and maybe better latency), and 2) it provided better visuals over Steam.   Also, when following the OpenXR configuration guide for my Reverb G2 one of the first rules was not to start anything related to Steam...

[Sr.]

I picked the wrong week to be out of town...

[dburne]

So seems there will be no fix for Aero users wanted to run in pure Open XR ( quad display issue) until March 1st or there abouts? I guess would just need to continue to use the wrapper provided by Mbucchia...

I am at this time just using Steam VR's Open XR runtime and it is doing ok.

Edited January 31, 2023 by dburne

[RealDCSpilot]

@rosteven1Don't confuse OpenComposite with OpenXR. OpenXR as a VR API is natively built into SteamVR as well. And OpenXR is basically the new standard for every VR runtime. (It already was about time for DCS getting it implemented.)

Edited January 31, 2023 by RealDCSpilot

[speed-of-heat]

6 hours ago, mbucchia said:

Released a new version of OpenXR Toolkit 1.2.4, when used with DCS in native OpenXR mode, will let you use WMR reprojection and also Turbo Mode.

Quickstart | OpenXR Toolkit (mbucchia.github.io)

Thanks for this!

[5ephir0th]

17 minutes ago, RealDCSpilot said:

@rosteven1Don't confuse OpenComposite with OpenXR. OpenXR as a VR API is natively built into SteamVR as well. And OpenXR is basically the new standard for every VR runtime. (It already was about time for DCS getting it implemented.)

 

Are you sure? The one that is native in SteamVR is OpenVR, OpenComposite is a wrapper that lets you run OpenXR on games with OpenVR support (and no OpenXR support, of course) 

Edited January 31, 2023 by 5ephir0th

[Baldrick33]

43 minutes ago, 5ephir0th said:

Are you sure? The one that is native in SteamVR is OpenVR, OpenComposite is a wrapper that lets you run OpenXR on games with OpenVR support (and no OpenXR support, of course) 

 

SteamVR got full OpenXR support some time ago https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/250820/view/3044967019267211914

We haven't been able to use it with DCS as it requires native support by the application.

Opencomposite provided a method of getting an application that supported OpenVR to use OpenXR by intercepting the OpenVR instructions and converting them (or something like that!).

So now that DCS has native OpenXR support we can use a number of OpenXR supported methods - Oculus, WMR, SteamVR etc.

For instance with my Reverb G1 I can select either the WMR OpenXR runtime or the SteamVR one and compare and contrast the performance, quality etc. My understanding is both "talk" direct to the device and I no longer need the WMR for SteamVR "bridge". I might try uninstalling the latter and see what happens!

Edit: Scratch the last bit - we still need the WMR for SteamVR driver for SteamVR to communicate with the WMR device using OpenXR, I guess that makes sense thinking about it.

Having tried both the performance seems much the same, anyone else tried both?

Edited January 31, 2023 by Baldrick33

[mbucchia]

2 hours ago, Tshark said:

Thank you so much for your efforts!!!!  Does the new version include the new re-projection that has been in testing?

 

You are mixing up OpenXR Toolkit and OpenXR for WMR.

OpenXR Toolkit doesn't implement any motion reprojection, the change you are looking for will be on OpenXR for WMR (when ready).

[Tshark]

I see.  Thanks for the clarification.  Wasn't rushing you and thanks again for all you have done for the DCS community.

[hannibal]

8 hours ago, mbucchia said:

Released a new version of OpenXR Toolkit 1.2.4, when used with DCS in native OpenXR mode, will let you use WMR reprojection and also Turbo Mode.

Quickstart | OpenXR Toolkit (mbucchia.github.io)

Even when @mbucchia gets hate.. he just keeps giving love. 

You have given us light to dcs vr performance. Cant thank u enough

[Baldrick33]

Having tried both WMR OpenXR & SteamVR OpenXR runtimes with motion reprojection the key difference is that the SteamVR OpenXR runtime seems to only give half refresh (45) whereas I can get 2/3 (30) and 1/4 (22.5) refresh with the WMR OpenXR runtime.

I find that dropping to 30 is surprisingly unnoticeable whereas dropping to say 42 with the SteamVR version it stutters way too much for me.

Edit to add: With the Apache (no mods) the reprojection wobble looking through the rotor blades is pretty much fixed using the SteamVR OpenXR runtime. So if you want reprojection and can run over 45fps then this may be worth trying pending the WMR runtime updates.

Edited January 31, 2023 by Baldrick33

[Sr.]

1 hour ago, Baldrick33 said:

SteamVR got full OpenXR support some time ago https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/250820/view/3044967019267211914

We haven't been able to use it with DCS as it requires native support by the application.

Opencomposite provided a method of getting an application that supported OpenVR to use OpenXR by intercepting the OpenVR instructions and converting them (or something like that!).

So now that DCS has native OpenXR support we can use a number of OpenXR supported methods - Oculus, WMR, SteamVR etc.

For instance with my Reverb G1 I can select either the WMR OpenXR runtime or the SteamVR one and compare and contrast the performance, quality etc. My understanding is both "talk" direct to the device and I no longer need the WMR for SteamVR "bridge". I might try uninstalling the latter and see what happens!

Edit: Scratch the last bit - we still need the WMR for SteamVR driver for SteamVR to communicate with the WMR device using OpenXR, I guess that makes sense thinking about it.

Having tried both the performance seems much the same, anyone else tried both?

 

I've tested both. Differences are negligeable.

[Baldrick33]

1 minute ago, Sr. said:

I've tested both. Differences are negligeable.

With reprojection on?

[Sr.]

2 minutes ago, Baldrick33 said:

With reprojection on?

Sorry no.... I don't use it.

Running at 60Hz I don't have a need for it. And I've never noticed the 60Hz flashing others mentioned.

But with recent improvements, maybe I'll give it a shot when I get back to my pit.

Edited January 31, 2023 by Sr.

[Baldrick33]

10 minutes ago, Sr. said:

Sorry no.... I don't use it.

Running at 60Hz I don't have a need for it. And I've never noticed the 60Hz flashing others mentioned.

But with recent improvements, maybe I'll give it a shot when I get back to my pit.

 

Understood.

I could never manage the flickering effect with 60Hz and getting 60fps on my PC would involve dropping the settings too much, the Apache zero chance!

That said the reprojection wobbly effect in the rotors and props doesn't bother me much, whilst others can't stand it. VR can be such a subjective thing!

For me I have to have reprojection if I can't run at 90fps (which I can't). It then opens up the opportunity to increase resolution and settings with a much lower fps target. 30fps is the surprising one as I would never have thought 30fps would be enough but it seems indistinguishable from 45 if I turn the counter off - at least for my eyes.

[jurinko]

I do not see Foveate rendering option in the Toolkit DCS menu now. I know it was like this before - FR was only available when going through OpenComposite. Is it possible to have it now?

 

Thx

[Delta-canard]

4 hours ago, Wali763 said:

Got one question:

Ever since the OpenXR-solution appeared in (wasit? ) spring, reprojection on AMD gpus war pretty poor and not bearable for  me.

My retests on the weekend did not show an improvement  for me. In OpenXR there still lots of "raindrops" on my visor.  SteamVR has those also, but to a much lower extent, so it is actually acceptable. But SteamVR has other problems.

Now, it was always written, that those reprojections issues will be resolved. But I somehow guess, that is more a problem of AMD and they would need to resolve it.

Is there any news, if or when those reprojection-problems for AMD-gpus will be fixed? Since it has not been resolved yet, my guess is, that this is not that easy to solve anyway.

I have very much the same concern, having a full AMD rig

[mbucchia]

7 minutes ago, jurinko said:

I do not see Foveate rendering option in the Toolkit DCS menu now. I know it was like this before - FR was only available when going through OpenComposite. Is it possible to have it now?

 

Thx

Make sure you are not running in Safe mode (there's a big red message in the menu when you do that).

FFR definitely works.

[jurinko]

I needed to reset it, otherwise in safe mode it showed Foveated rendering kill switch ON/OFF and in normal mode none. Now it is ok. Thanks!

 

[zildac]

1 hour ago, Baldrick33 said:

Having tried both WMR OpenXR & SteamVR OpenXR runtimes with motion reprojection the key difference is that the SteamVR OpenXR runtime seems to only give half refresh (45) whereas I can get 2/3 (30) and 1/4 (22.5) refresh with the WMR OpenXR runtime.

I find that dropping to 30 is surprisingly unnoticeable whereas dropping to say 42 with the SteamVR version it stutters way too much for me.

Edit to add: With the Apache (no mods) the reprojection wobble looking through the rotor blades is pretty much fixed using the SteamVR OpenXR runtime. So if you want reprojection and can run over 45fps then this may be worth trying pending the WMR runtime updates.

 

As I recall, this was also the case when I had my G2 and ran OpenXRToolkit and OpenComposite. 90-45-30 which was one of the major benefits.

[Baldrick33]

14 minutes ago, zildac said:

As I recall, this was also the case when I had my G2 and ran OpenXRToolkit and OpenComposite. 90-45-30 which was one of the major benefits.

Yes it was, I just assumed that was an OpenXR thing and Steam's implementation of it would do the same. It appears not so.

Edited January 31, 2023 by Baldrick33

[Burt]

Is it best to delete the old version then update to the new version of the oxrtk

Disregard I saw the check for newer version. GtG. 
 

Thanks mbucchia for all you do for us.

Edited January 31, 2023 by Burt