waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[NineLine]

10 minutes ago, Mizzy said:

So is it Razbam that are holding things up ?

Sorry I think that was a typo, we are still waiting on both sides to finish this up, thanks!

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

7 hours ago, Mizzy said:

So is it Razbam that are holding things up ?

I wouldn't read too much into it. It could be a typo as 9L stated or even something as benign as a lawyer faxing/mailing something.

[BIGNEWY]

On 3/11/2025 at 1:35 AM, MiG21bisFishbedL said:

I wouldn't read too much into it. It could be a typo as 9L stated or even something as benign as a lawyer faxing/mailing something.

yep typo, "for" should have been a "with" RAZBAM

[Citizen]

10 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

yep typo, for should have been a with RAZBAM

This is interesting context.  If RAZBAM and ED are waiting with each other, that indicates that there is another party they are waiting on.

[Mike Force Team]

I am happy we are enjoying circular discussions that lead to no resolution one year after RZ complained about non-payment. We can celebrate the standoff with cold brewskies.

Edited March 11 by Mike Force Team

[AndyJWest]

2 hours ago, Citizen said:

This is interesting context.  If RAZBAM and ED are waiting with each other, that indicates that there is another party they are waiting on.

No it doesn't. It indicates that over-analysing comments made in passing is a pointless occupation.

[BIGNEWY]

27 minutes ago, AndyJWest said:

No it doesn't. It indicates that over-analysing comments made in passing is a pointless occupation.

For sure some people try to read to much into comments. Some are looking for drama others a looking for hope. As soon as we have news to share we will share it. 

[Pmonteiro8668]

Perhaps we are entering in a more optmistic moment, good to know. But also don´t want to give too much hope

[Rudel_chw]

8 minutes ago, Pmonteiro8668 said:

Perhaps we are entering in a more optmistic moment, good to know. But also don´t want to give too much hope

 

I'm not sure if this image is true or fake, but I for sure hope it is an indication that the Razbam-ED affair might reach a positive agreement:

 

 

fingers crossed 

[Pmonteiro8668]

It´s true. You can check directly on RB discord if you want. Search for Razbam_Prowler comments 

[Joe1978]

I hope I don't offend anyone but in case RB were to return, as a user, I would feel more comfortable if they finished EVERYTHING they have pending (starting with their oldest modules and of course, everything related to the F15) before selling us more "smoke": Mirage 2000D, Mig23, Prowler..... are just promises.

After what happened, would you buy a RB module again? They have a lot of work to do and a lot of things to prove before selling us anything IMHO. 

I would have felt more confident if the real developers had moved away from RB and created their own 3rd party.

Joe 

[draconus]

17 minutes ago, Joe1978 said:

I hope I don't offend anyone but in case RB were to return, as a user, I would feel more comfortable if they finished EVERYTHING they have pending (starting with their oldest modules and of course, everything related to the F15) before selling us more "smoke": Mirage 2000D, Mig23, Prowler..... are just promises.

Why would Razbam work different than ED and other 3d parties? They also rely on EA and none of the projects you mentioned were officially announced as coming to DCS by ED newsletter. Or you mean "smoke" like F4U or Bo-105?

20 minutes ago, Joe1978 said:

After what happened, would you buy a RB module again?

For sure if it was at F-15E top quality. I buy a product, not interested in devs drama, which only affects module's updates and campaigns development for me.

[Joe1978]

Without wanting to get into an argument, anything not available in the store or installed on a PC is just smoke and mirrors to me (F4u,Bo-135, Iranian Tomcat...). In this case, I've only mentioned RB since we're talking about them: obviously, we could talk about other modules, as you rightly point out, but that's not the case here.

I agree with you. I buy a product and I'm not interested in the drama (I have only participated in these threads on two or three occasions)I'm interested only in the finished product and its maintenance, things that RB doesn't usually pay attention: Suddenly there is a problem between two companies and the flight model of the M2000 breaks, the radar of the F15 stops working... you mentioned the campaigns, for example: the ones that come with RB modules have been broken for years and have been reported countless times. 

As previously stated, my sole concern is the completion of I already or paid for. I am not interested their good intentions or future projects.

joe 

 

[VR Flight Guy in PJ Pants]

To beat a dead horse, just a search on RB Discord.

Still flying them as if nothing had happened.

[felixx75]

2 hours ago, Joe1978 said:

would you buy a RB module again?

Definitely and immediately (assuming it's a module that interests me).

Edited March 12 by felixx75

[falcon_120]

What to say, seems like a glimpse of hope of a resolution.

I'll stay tuned for news 

[bjdy]

2 hours ago, Joe1978 said:

After what happened, would you buy a RB module again? 

 

Yes! The Strike Eagle was pretty great at release, so why not?

[Joe1978]

Excuse me, just a quick note on my comments: English is not my native language. My question is rhetorical... everyone should make the decision that best suits them, of course.

[Hiob]

1 hour ago, felixx75 said:

Definitely and immediately (assuming it's a module that interests me).

dito.

Modules are not exactly life changing investments and Razbam makes/made great modules. 
 

Happy about the glimpse of hope! 

[Horns]

3 hours ago, Joe1978 said:

I hope I don't offend anyone but in case RB were to return, as a user, I would feel more comfortable if they finished EVERYTHING they have pending (starting with their oldest modules and of course, everything related to the F15) before selling us more "smoke": Mirage 2000D, Mig23, Prowler..... are just promises.

After what happened, would you buy a RB module again? They have a lot of work to do and a lot of things to prove before selling us anything IMHO. 

I would have felt more confident if the real developers had moved away from RB and created their own 3rd party.

Joe 

Based on my experience buying Razbam modules, I would never buy another module made by them - even if it was DCS: F-22A. While I agree modules aren't major purchases, the free market works best when companies that don't treat consumers with respect don't get sales, and in my opinion that describes Razbam. Others obviously disagree, all opinions are valid.

[falcon_120]

51 minutes ago, Horns said:

Based on my experience buying Razbam modules, I would never buy another module made by them - even if it was DCS: F-22A. While I agree modules aren't major purchases, the free market works best when companies that don't treat consumers with respect don't get sales, and in my opinion that describes Razbam. Others obviously disagree, all opinions are valid.

Let's be practical and don't hold SW companies to crazy high standards like public servants. RAZBAM does make great modules (they did crappy implementation at first but now have found its way with the status of Harrier/M2000C/F15E). If they resolve their situation with ED and retake on the F15e and other projects, I will definitely buy their modules again. Maybe i'm naive but i want to give then the opportunity for redemption like they will not air internal disputes like this again and will be truly professional in the future. 

Also being totally practical, even if they are not perfect, like ED is not by any stretch of the imagination perfect, we are not in a crowded market with tons of companies doing similar products. I take what it is, i enjoy it while i can and i'm grateful that the options even exist...

[Horns]

On 3/12/2025 at 8:53 PM, falcon_120 said:

Let's be practical and don't hold SW companies to crazy high standards like public servants. RAZBAM does make great modules (they did crappy implementation at first but now have found its way with the status of Harrier/M2000C/F15E). If they resolve their situation with ED and retake on the F15e and other projects, I will definitely buy their modules again. Maybe i'm naive but i want to give then the opportunity for redemption like they will not air internal disputes like this again and will be truly professional in the future. 

Also being totally practical, even if they are not perfect, like ED is not by any stretch of the imagination perfect, we are not in a crowded market with tons of companies doing similar products. I take what it is, i enjoy it while i can and i'm grateful that the options even exist...

I’ll respond to the suggestion that what I said applies “crazy high standards’ by detailing what I’m basing this on and people can judge for themselves whether my expectations are unreasonable or if there is some equivalence between this and the issues with ED products:

The M2K at release, ie not in EA, lacked a true manual, had glaring inaccuracies, had a radar that was erratic at best and a flight model just as erratic. Eventually they did produce a manual, and subsequently the emergence of a new source of revenue in the AdA finally led to Razbam improving the other aspects.

The AV-8 had almost twelve months in EA with very little development (some maintenance was done) and was moved out of EA with only half a manual and several missing features, this is still the case more than four years later.

Razbam attempted to release the MiG-19 as release-level but were forced to release it as EA (as RZ himself complained) with much more done before it was passed out of EA. I’ll let owners of the module comment on how it is now.

And so we come to the F-15E and the stunted development that has been well documented in this thread. If others feel this behavior treats customers with due respect then please go ahead and buy Razbam products now or in the future.

IMPORTANT EDIT: I should have pointed out that the lack of a true and complete manual for the M2K and AV-8 was mentioned in the context of these features being promised in the shop description after these products left EA. There are in fact many modules that do not come with manuals, thanks to Rudel_chw for pointing that out.

Edited March 13 by Horns
Important Clarification

[Gary]

A little perspective might help when people consider how they feel about a dev or module.

If half finished manuals or implementation is not for you then steer clear of EA alltogether - problem solved.

Wait for the finished article and then buy it, even better wait for one of the many sales and get it then. Broadly speaking I would wager you could pick up most modules (albeit after a wait) for around £50 UK pounds or so.

That's about the same price of a round of golf or a couple of evenings down the pub or another activity that's a one time event.

Anyone would think we were shelling out several grand for a rolls royce that got delivered with dents in the bodywork.

Not poking anyone here - just saying its a hobby that we invest in of course but as has been said - its not like the market is awash with other options is it.

Regards,

Gary

[Gunnar81]

I thinks its a case of Razbam is good at some things and not at others. All I would like to see is work resume on the modules. While not perfect they were on the right track for the most part

5 minutes ago, Gary said:

A little perspective might help when people consider how they feel about a dev or module.

If half finished manuals or implementation is not for you then steer clear of EA alltogether - problem solved.

Wait for the finished article and then buy it, even better wait for one of the many sales and get it then. Broadly speaking I would wager you could pick up most modules (albeit after a wait) for around £50 UK pounds or so.

That's about the same price of a round of golf or a couple of evenings down the pub or another activity that's a one time event.

Anyone would think we were shelling out several grand for a rolls royce that got delivered with dents in the bodywork.

Not poking anyone here - just saying its a hobby that we invest in of course but as has been said - its not like the market is awash with other options is it.

Regards,

Gary

Good points. Razbam is who they is! Modules are pretty good works in progress, community realtions maybe not so much. Its all perspective tho, for some people a transaction for a product is like a blood oath for life, for others its nothing more than a night out at the pub.

[Silver_Dragon]

7 hours ago, draconus said:

Or you mean "smoke" like F4U or Bo-105?

What "Smoke"?....