waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[Rudel_chw]

1 hour ago, Mizzy said:

So you don't have the F4e?

 

I do have it … pre purchased on December last year 

 

1 hour ago, Mizzy said:

… it was clearly them who created this mess by stealing IP and trying to profit from their theft?

wonder how you can be so sure of that 

[Oban]

1 hour ago, lee1hy said:

NOW officially dead?

no solution for 9 months, ??

 

Said nobody from Eagle Dynamics, or Razbam... ever !

[corvey]

Just now, Czar66 said:

It just hits different when you can generate such images 45nm away.

 

 

ME seeing the F-4E Phantom's radar

 

 

[MiGCap1]

6 hours ago, Lord_Pyro said:

Still sweeping left and right

I can confirm that the radar of the MiG-19 still works flawlessly.

It is without any tactical worth nonetheless. 

[afnav130]

1 hour ago, NineLine said:

Sadly this is not how the legal process works. Nothing about this can be described as easy.

Sure it is, if one party is clearly in the wrong. If both parties have part of the <profanity> sandwich then it gets hard. If I know I am right, then I don't care what they say, I know I am right. 

1 hour ago, Nightdare said:

 

...how long does law school last?

If legalese was easy, it wouldn't take 7 years to get the required degrees

You don't need 7 years of law school if someone is clearly in the wrong. That should be fairly easy to figure out. I truly wonder if there is some loophole that ED didn't see or know about and is trying to shut that down now. Thats the only thing that I can see being an issue. If RB was clearly in the wrong, there is nothing any lawyer could do to change that. Someone here was right, and someone was wrong. I highly doubt both were right, or both were wrong. 

[NineLine]

26 minutes ago, afnav130 said:

Sure it is, if one party is clearly in the wrong. If both parties have part of the <profanity> sandwich then it gets hard. If I know I am right, then I don't care what they say, I know I am right. 

You don't need 7 years of law school if someone is clearly in the wrong. That should be fairly easy to figure out. I truly wonder if there is some loophole that ED didn't see or know about and is trying to shut that down now. Thats the only thing that I can see being an issue. If RB was clearly in the wrong, there is nothing any lawyer could do to change that. Someone here was right, and someone was wrong. I highly doubt both were right, or both were wrong. 

Well no arguing with that I guess...

[av8orDave]

34 minutes ago, afnav130 said:

Sure it is, if one party is clearly in the wrong. If both parties have part of the <profanity> sandwich then it gets hard. If I know I am right, then I don't care what they say, I know I am right. 

You don't need 7 years of law school if someone is clearly in the wrong. That should be fairly easy to figure out. I truly wonder if there is some loophole that ED didn't see or know about and is trying to shut that down now. Thats the only thing that I can see being an issue. If RB was clearly in the wrong, there is nothing any lawyer could do to change that. Someone here was right, and someone was wrong. I highly doubt both were right, or both were wrong. 

Any idea how long discovery takes? How about depositions, not to mention the preparation that takes place for depositions? Are experts required to sort out any sort of accounting for a settlement offer or for trial?…

and on and on and on…

“Fairly easy to figure out” is not often a thing once it enters the legal realm.

[PhantomHans]

Maybe both of them are right and wrong at once.

 

You know what?

 

I don't care.

 

Pay Razbam.  Announce that you're doing it.  Tell the world you do it to show good faith and restore confidence to the consumer.  At the same time announce that you admit no wrongdoing and will be bringing a case against Razbam to [force them to stop, force them to share profit, force them to pay for something, force them to do something, etc whatever] and then do it.

 

If they have to pay back 3x or 4x or even 1,000,000,000 times as much money as the withheld sales, so what.  In fact if you sue them into bankruptcy and they officially cease to exist as a company so much the better for ED.  Hooray for you, big winner, now buy their dried up husk and take their source codes.

 

But ffs just pay them and get them back to supporting their stuff.  Maybe just MAYBE it will help facilitate a solution. 

[Nightdare]

4 minutes ago, PhantomHans said:

Pay Razbam.  Announce that you're doing it.  Tell the world you do it to show good faith and restore confidence to the consumer.  At the same time announce that you admit no wrongdoing and will be bringing a case against Razbam

 

Really?!?

What you are stating is like having sex with the person you're gonna sue for rape, I don't need to be a lawyer to know that will NOT help your case

 

[Hammer1-1]

7 minutes ago, Nightdare said:

 

Really?!?

What you are stating is like having sex with the person you're gonna sue for rape, I don't need to be a lawyer to know that will NOT help your case

 

depending on who you talk to, that COULD be an invitation..

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

2 hours ago, MiGCap1 said:

I can confirm that the radar of the MiG-19 still works flawlessly.

It is without any tactical worth nonetheless. 

I mean, I didn't want to say anything, but... yeah.

 

 

32 minutes ago, PhantomHans said:

Pay Razbam.  Announce that you're doing it.  Tell the world you do it to show good faith and restore confidence to the consumer.  At the same time announce that you admit no wrongdoing and will be bringing a case against Razbam to [force them to stop, force them to share profit, force them to pay for something, force them to do something, etc whatever] and then do it.

 

 

In what world would RB, in this situation, have any incentive consider working for ED again if they're actually going to settle this dispute the legal route?

If they cut you a check and then say "lmao we gon sue you" then why should I, as a developer, reply with "lol ok here more work on strike eagle."

I'm cutting and running, as would 99% of the rest of humanity. That cash I just got? That's either going into legal defense or a settlement. The fact that ED wants to settle this commercially means they do want to go forward, that they do want RB to continue. But, what they won't do is set a precedent for exploitation. This is their software. What you suggest would literally kill any updates that the team may have had for existing modules until a new team could pick them up. The part that keeps getting forgotten: https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/support/faq/685/
 

This ain't the first time.

Edited June 15, 2024 by MiG21bisFishbedL

[Oban]

So many new lawyers throwing their 2cents worth, having done an online corporate law degree over the past week...

[afnav130]

31 minutes ago, PhantomHans said:

Maybe both of them are right and wrong at once.

 

You know what?

 

I don't care.

 

Pay Razbam.  Announce that you're doing it.  Tell the world you do it to show good faith and restore confidence to the consumer.  At the same time announce that you admit no wrongdoing and will be bringing a case against Razbam to [force them to stop, force them to share profit, force them to pay for something, force them to do something, etc whatever] and then do it.

 

If they have to pay back 3x or 4x or even 1,000,000,000 times as much money as the withheld sales, so what.  In fact if you sue them into bankruptcy and they officially cease to exist as a company so much the better for ED.  Hooray for you, big winner, now buy their dried up husk and take their source codes.

 

But ffs just pay them and get them back to supporting their stuff.  Maybe just MAYBE it will help facilitate a solution. 

Better option than a lot I have seen here. If the SE isn't part of the IP issue then to me thats a no brainer. People LOVE to bring lawyers into the situation getting 500 per billable hour. They love it. They usually muck things up so much the solution never becomes clear. What could have been solved over a couple of beers now gets extended to oblivion. My guess is RB said F you and then ED said F you right back and here we are.

Once lawyers get involved, nobody wins. 

[Oban]

1 minute ago, afnav130 said:

Better option than a lot I have seen here. If the SE isn't part of the IP issue then to me thats a no brainer. People LOVE to bring lawyers into the situation getting 500 per billable hour. They love it. They usually muck things up so much the solution never becomes clear. What could have been solved over a couple of beers now gets extended to oblivion. My guess is RB said F you and then ED said F you right back and here we are.

Once lawyers get involved, nobody wins. 

Hunter Biden wants to know your crack dealer...

The entertainment level here is going through the roof

[javelina1]

3 minutes ago, afnav130 said:

Better option than a lot I have seen here. If the SE isn't part of the IP issue then to me thats a no brainer. People LOVE to bring lawyers into the situation getting 500 per billable hour. They love it. They usually muck things up so much the solution never becomes clear. What could have been solved over a couple of beers now gets extended to oblivion. My guess is RB said F you and then ED said F you right back and here we are.

Once lawyers get involved, nobody wins. 

Except...  

I hope for the best, none the less.

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

2 minutes ago, afnav130 said:

Better option than a lot I have seen here. If the SE isn't part of the IP issue then to me thats a no brainer. People LOVE to bring lawyers into the situation getting 500 per billable hour. They love it. They usually muck things up so much the solution never becomes clear. What could have been solved over a couple of beers now gets extended to oblivion. My guess is RB said F you and then ED said F you right back and here we are.

Once lawyers get involved, nobody wins. 

It's almost as if you want an expert to handle complex subjects.

I wouldn't hire my local crackfiend who swears the world is run by lizard people to work on a nuclear power facility, after all.

[afnav130]

5 minutes ago, MiG21bisFishbedL said:

It's almost as if you want an expert to handle complex subjects.

I wouldn't hire my local crackfiend who swears the world is run by lizard people to work on a nuclear power facility, after all.

The lizard people aren't real? 

[Hammer1-1]

if they are, I wouldnt want them to either.

[Brk195]

With the radar issue looming finally caved and opened a ticket for the F-15.

I really don’t want to do this, this whole business sucks.

[Maverick87Shaka]

1 hour ago, Brk195 said:

With the radar issue looming finally caved and opened a ticket for the F-15.

I really don’t want to do this, this whole business sucks.

I'm holding my Strike Eagle hoping a solution it will arrive, soon or later, and don't loose the discount applied at the beginning.

The Radar problems looks like a "kill-switch" rather then a real problem occurs during DCS Core feature upgrade, and I'm really disappointed about that.
I really hope that someone can clarify if it's an intended behavior (basically release an update with an expiration date, that it's illegal in basically every country in the world) or it's just a technical drawback of some sort, involving dll signature or other stuff.

[Tom Kazansky]

15 minutes ago, Maverick87Shaka said:

I'm holding my Strike Eagle hoping a solution it will arrive, soon or later, and don't loose the discount applied at the beginning.

The Radar problems looks like a "kill-switch" rather then a real problem occurs during DCS Core feature upgrade, and I'm really disappointed about that.
I really hope that someone can clarify if it's an intended behavior (basically release an update with an expiration date, that it's illegal in basically every country in the world) or it's just a technical drawback of some sort, involving dll signature or other stuff.

+1

[Viper ZA]

I been mostly just ready this thread, but as a older gamer and DCS player for the last few year. I feel ED needs to lock RB modules from purchase. For two reason. First been that we been left In the dark as to what may happen once everyone at RB and ED pulls their fingers out and response to the public as to what is happening. Will they continue updating the modules. If there is no clear answer right now, then you basically steal peoples money by not giving them a early access product that will be completed as promised. Put them on hold. Most people call this a scam these days. So be responsible and don't give new players broken product.
Second why I say put them on hold, is because the public is putting RB modules on hold on their servers. Even though the Harrier works fine and this to will effect some new players who just bought a RB module and joins one of these servers and can't find his new shiny module to fly.

A similar problem happened with Star Citizen with selling new ships that hadn't released yet. They had to change t/c for these due to legal ramifications. Does ED not have a lawyer. I'm sure I've watched enough episodes of Suits to know that a lawyer would have told you to do this:) 

Edited June 15, 2024 by Viper ZA

[felixx75]

7 hours ago, Sr. said:

Should we be asking for store credit/refund for the South Atlantic(RAZBAM) map as well?

Pretty sure that one will never be updated again.

I'm curious, where do you get this knowledge from?

[Blackeye]

6 hours ago, Nightdare said:

they are the same

Any dispute could make you lose your IP, it's not just about abuse of licenses, but,.. oh I don't know,... Bankruptcy?

No they're distinctively different things things - one may lead to the other but that's it.

6 hours ago, Nightdare said:

Fine, then stop buying modules and let ED go the way of the Dodo, I'm sure you'll be happier that way

If you can't have your F-15, it's better that no one plays DCS anymore, right? Who cares about ED or any of the other 3rd party contractors who apparently are NOT in dispute with ED

ED should just keep paying RB and lose money (or reimburse it with higher module prices) , so you get what you want

I'm amazed how people read one thing and then construct things in their head that author also "must" think and then go on rants about their imagined stuff instead of discussing things that were actually said.

 

6 hours ago, Nightdare said:

If they hadn't ,you'd know nothing if the dispute was resolved and only heard something when there is actually an issue with RB modules because of this

We'd still see the stopped development of RB modules with them breaking without any effort to fix them and expect a reasonable explanation. Not sure they could've provide a satisfying one without straight up lying. In any case we DO know and we're talking about what ED does or not given the actual situation.

Edited June 15, 2024 by Blackeye

[SkateZilla]

 

I guess I use AIm-9s for a while.,

Edited June 15, 2024 by SkateZilla