Force Trim

[dburne]

5 minutes ago, Agrrregat said:

I think most of us are flying on spring stick, not FFB. 

Possibility to Reset Trim is must have, because trying to transition form lvl flight to hover and trim is crazy.

 

So are you able to trim for forward flight?

[dburne]

Looks like Wags just uploaded a video covering some questions from the community on the Apache in the mini updates thread. He lists the force trim as one of the topics. I have to run out now will check it out later, hope it helps.

Edited March 18, 2022 by dburne

[elchacal]

1 hour ago, Dannyvandelft said:

I found a work around that works. I bound the control indicator on my pinky switch, and when I need to transition I can see exactly where it's trimmed and what I need to do to trim it back to center. As soon as that's done, pinky switch to remove the indicator off screen.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 

That way worked for me! Thanks!

Edited March 18, 2022 by elchacal

[yinlad]

The issue I'm having with the trim is that even with the correct 'special' options, only my rudder "holds" once set. Watching the control trace I can see the red cross set for both cyclic and anti torque, but after releasing the controls the white diamond for cyclic goes straight back to dead centre away from the trim set position, while rudder is locked to to the red cross the force trim set.

 

Any idea on what might be causing it?

[some1]

Ffb trim enabled in special options? I've no idea why ED decided FFB trim Mode is the default option.

 

[Olajuwon]

For all using a MSFFB2 or another FFB stick and stuggling with force trim, try this:

Swap X and Y axis on your stick over the 'FF Tune'-Options in your control bindings. This stopped the jumping of my ffb stick when i used the force trim button. Now it stays physically in the position when i press force trim, like expected.

My rudder is on the Z/twist axis of the stick, and set to 'Central position trimmer mode'.

I really struggled using force trim with my MSFFB2 on the AH-64 the whole evening, but now it makes sense and is pretty cool to use. 

[YeaImRota]

18 minutes ago, Olajuwon said:

For all using a MSFFB2 or another FFB stick and stuggling with force trim, try this:

Swap X and Y axis on your stick over the 'FF Tune'-Options in your control bindings. This stopped the jumping of my ffb stick when i used the force trim button. Now it stays physically in the position when i press force trim, like expected.

My rudder is on the Z/twist axis of the stick, and set to 'Central position trimmer mode'.

I really struggled using force trim with my MSFFB2 on the AH-64 the whole evening, but now it makes sense and is pretty cool to use. 

 

Just as a heads-up if you decide to try any of the other modules with the FFB2, you'll need to make sure to check the "Swap Axis" checkbox on those as well or the forces will be backwards. 

[tech_op2000]

 

The ATT Hold and ALT Hold functions are not here yet and will be implemented more in later updates. There is one function of the ATT hold in now. I think its velocity hold, but im not entirely sure.

Edited March 19, 2022 by tech_op2000

[Dannyvandelft]

 
The ATT Hold and ALT Hold functions are not here yet and will be implemented more in later updates. There is one function of the ATT hold in now. I think its velocity hold, but im not entirely sure.

ATT hold does work. You'll know it's on because your speed indicator is boxed.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[mwlue]

The "Force Trim Right" key seems have sth to do helping stability abit, but still very unstable on takeoff

[Eldur]

1 hour ago, Dannyvandelft said:

ATT hold does work. You'll know it's on because your speed indicator is boxed.

I haven't been able to see or feel anything it does except for the bit you mentioned. FFB user here.

[Dannyvandelft]

I haven't been able to see or feel anything it does except for the bit you mentioned. FFB user here.

You have to use it over X amount of speed. It then holds the nose in that attitude.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[NineLine]

Make sure you check out Wag's videos on this as well. Thanks.

[Zergburger]

i think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of how the trim works

this does not work like the trim in other helos in DCS. Attitude hold is like ATT hold in a fixed wing, if you have a vector, it will hold you there.

The force trim in central position trim mode is what you want ot be using without a FFB stick. you must recenter your pedals and stick when you hit up on trim hat. tbh unlike the ka-50 where you want to use the trim button every time you mvoe the stick, just consider using the trim for large changes in flight regime. EG: flying at 40kts, then accelling to 120kts.

[scampaboy]

I seem to be coming upon two problems. 
I don’t have a problem with how trim is implemented although I would like access to the “default” version that was on the KA50 where you had half a second to centre, it didn’t hold the controls till you centred.
It feels to me that when I set trim the stick or pedals are adding more trim when the press/release process is done again. 
The way I understand it is that if you are force trimmed then if you hold the trim again the stick is free to move until you let go of the force trim which resets the trim position with no need for a reset button. 
With me it feels like if you re trim and that authority is added on to the existing stick/pedal authority not cancelling out the previous lock. 
 

Fully understand attitude or altitude hold aren’t implemented yet 

it’s debatable whether the reset is as well 

 

Forgot to add, if I don’t use trim at all I have a perfectly stable flight, all be it with sore shoulders. If I need to do something on the McD screens I jump over the the cfg and let George hover for a minute. It’s cheating but until I get my head round the trim that’s what I’m going to do 

Edited March 19, 2022 by scampaboy

[Nevyn]

I was also a little lost on it at first, I very rarely use the controls indicator on any airframe but this time it helped me understand what the trim was doing. As Zergburger says it doesn't work like the KA-50 and that I think is screwing with many peoples mind. The KA-50 trim is like a sledge hammer, the apaches one is more like a feather duster.

[HelipilotEGLW]

Hi,

it might better just to have a trim reset to centre command. I know its not realistic; but most of us are using spring loaded joysticks, i think it would help. 

[Razor18]

Yes I choosed a wrong setting, all OK now.

[schmiefel]

3 hours ago, Dannyvandelft said:

You have to use it over X amount of speed. It then holds the nose in that attitude.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 

Sure, that one needs a certain amount of speed? I maybe mis-used it by activating it before take-off into hover (got a boxed speed indicator) and it made my hover attempts much more stable. I am using the stick with spring trim profile.

[Hiob]

17 hours ago, SandMan23 said:

Flying as Pilot trimmed out. Switch to CPG blow stuff up. Switch back to Pilot and all of my trim setting are reset to center causing immediate pitch up.  Is this normal?

Have you checked the „Auto AI handover“ in the special options?

[jojo]

ALT Hold mode is not simulated yet, but from what I read, ATT Hold doesn't seem to work as expected either. But I'm not sure.
For instance, below 05kt it should maintain hover position & heading. It doesn't seem to do so currently...

But please tell me if you manage to make it work ?

[jojo]

ATT Hold function depends on speed thresholds 

V < 05kt: hover (X + Y postion & heading hold)

05kt < V < 40kt: Velocity Hold (Vx + Vy & heading hold)

40kt < V: hold attitude (pitch < 30°/ Roll < 60°), if roll < 3° : wings level

If I understand correclty, using FTR should allow to set new reference for ATT Hold.

[yinlad]

One thing that had me over was in Options -> Misc, Force Feedback was checked. Unchecking that made my trim actually work

[tusler]

Two things were making the trim impossibly hard to use for me. On the one screen by default Game Mode is checked when installed. I removed that check mark and turned off the recenter force trim for the pedals and put it on the trim for no centering spring. Immediately there was a massive difference in how the heli hovered and easy it is to go through transition to fwd flight and back into a hover.

[dburne]

1 hour ago, tusler said:

Two things were making the trim impossibly hard to use for me. On the one screen by default Game Mode is checked when installed. I removed that check mark and turned off the recenter force trim for the pedals and put it on the trim for no centering spring. Immediately there was a massive difference in how the heli hovered and easy it is to go through transition to fwd flight and back into a hover.

I am getting better now with the trim after watching Wags latest video. Managed to trim nicely for forward fight and 100 knots, however had some trouble trying to get trimmed back into a hover. Going to keep trying,